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Post your screenshots! WIP thread

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Forums > Maps and Mods

13 Mar 17, 20:18
By James Luke
avatar
Member
What was the error log exactly? I have a lot of extra code packed on and I dunno if mine would ever get under ~1000 errors/warnings.

Chances are if I'd ever move to the mess that is Xash3D/XT, I'd look into implementing the IVP and Havok physics engine, and studying Valve's implementation of it.

Which to me I find funny in it's own right...putting leaked illegal code into code that is based on illegal leaked code.

But I'd invest in fixing up Newton and having simple, stupid physics. Just don't know why mine doesn't work anyone. Something I did must've messed it up. Hopefully someone or I can fix that in the near future.

The only problem I see is that I can't access collision data from server/client side...it's all engine code. And Valve aren't way too keen on releasing that either. Although it would probably benefit them.

So that might have to be delayed.

Aside from that, I finished all the main textures from Half-Life 2..just need to add the transparency to some of the textures. Also converted all the skyboxes over, blurry, but I hope fixing up the PARANOIA renderer will allow me to replace that with a 512-version like HL2. Also just finished converting the weapons and weapon items. Just need the sounds and I'll being coding. Then onto the actual HUD. And so forth. A lot of work to be done.
13 Mar 17, 22:04
By Victor-933
avatar
Member
Quote:
Post your screenshots!


how about I post a video instead

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dousurwwElI
13 Mar 17, 22:48
By James Luke
avatar
Member
Quote:
how about I post a video instead

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dousurwwElI



Well that was sudden...
I know it's a bit off-topic, but should I use VGUI or stick with regular HUD sprites to display the HUD? It's supposed to look like the Half-Life 2 HUD.
13 Mar 17, 23:33
By Shepard62700FR
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Member
I think "sprites" will be enough considering that you have most of the job already done.
14 Mar 17, 00:00
By James Luke
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Member
I guess I'll have to figure out how to do that. Thanks.

I may as well post some pictures when I'm done with that so we can be on-topic.
14 Mar 17, 08:02
By Crollo
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Trollo
@Crypt Will do when I get a minute.

This midsection was a real bitch, and will continue to be while I tap the remaining holes on the bottom. Next time I'm not chamfering any edges until I know I will have an equal amount for the holes that will be put in later.

@Victor That is the first time I've seen somebody use func_train for an actual train.
14 Mar 17, 14:07
By Admer456
avatar
Member
@Shepard62700FR
Quote:
"nice try son, you forgot one thing : clipnodes."


Nice try, and that "try" had its success in one of my maps.
If you've seen my The Specialists map, ts_untergrund, you'd have noticed that it has a lot of triangles and tetrahedrons. The rest are, well, 4-sided prisms, i.e. usual brushes.

I only had the clipnodes problem when I converted the terrain into a func_detail. But then we have the bevel texture which supposedly removes clipping from the surface it's applied onto.
14 Mar 17, 19:28
By Victor-933
avatar
Member
Quote:
@Victor That is the first time I've seen somebody use func_train for an actual train.


technically it's 14 func_trains set to passable, with a ton of func_wall_toggle and trigger_hurt to maintain the illusion of running people over; if I simply relied on func_train collision detection they'd "stick" on people and get out of sync. It's split up because if they were all one brush entity it'd be longer than Hammer's max allowable dimensions.
14 Mar 17, 23:37
By Shepard62700FR
avatar
Member
@Admer : Your map has nice terrain for the Gold Source engine and if it runs well on old PCs then it's good. But I think you missed the point that HL2 displacements is a different story than what GS mappers can achieve with vertex manipulation.
Add the fact that Source maps are x4 times bigger than Gold Source maps we can conclude that standard Gold Source will likely cry (I even doubt if the map would be compilable).

Take a look at this image I've found on Google Images :



I highly doubt that if you replace the displacements by brushes under GS it would compile.

@James Luke : about the physics engine, I think you don't really need to access engine data to achieve that. Server side should be enough.
15 Mar 17, 02:42
By James Luke
avatar
Member
@Sherpard:

I just checked, there are some physics calls being handled within the engine.

But that aside, it would be a lot better to handle everything client-side. Not as many pre-defined limits there. Also the networking would kill your PC...even after having like 100 physics-entities. And I have a relatively powerful computer.

The only problem would be is changing the physics code engine-side to handle Newton within Half-Life, and allowing for collisions with Newton objects. Regular Half-Life only supports SIMPLE collisions. Very SIMPLE collisions.

That's why HL2 changes that with Havok, it adds new collision types that makes it compatible with dynamically-shaped objects. But that's done in the engine. Which is locked closely by Valve. Hopefully they can change that sometime though... But I highly doubt it. Even then, I still have to fix it because I found some way to break it. Something about random access violations.
15 Mar 17, 23:17
By Trempler
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Member
was doing some more textures for fun

16 Mar 17, 01:01
By James Luke
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Member
@Trempler

It looks great.

Anyways, starting to add in all the effects. Decided I'm gonna use VGUI for the HUD now. No more nasty sprites and that would free up some precaching limits I believe.

Just gotta get that done and the renderer, along with completing all of the weapons, for now...they're just fancy viewmodel displayers.

Also did the lazy-weapon from an old HLFX.ru tutorial. But there are flaws like waving the weapon up-and-down makes the viewmodel look STUPID. But that aside. Progressing well. Here are some test screenshots.




16 Mar 17, 03:17
By James Luke
avatar
Member
Well, just finished implementing the renderer. Needs a lot of fixing and cleaning up since it was written in 2006 and needs an old .dll that will """"break"""" it if it isn't there.

Wonder if I can ever set the depth-ranges without the .dll...or the stencil buffer and alpha buffer...

16 Mar 17, 07:34
By Admer456
avatar
Member
@Shepard62700FR
I saw a map on GameBanana which took 15 days to compile. Guess because of who? HlVis!
To be honest, I would be fine with letting my laptop compile a map as long as that, lol.

Interestingly, I have a Half-Life map, FILLED with these triangles (inside a 2048^3 area) and HlVis runs it all in under 4 minutes.

Well, I admit, it doesn't have very high-poly terrain. They're in the parts of the map. One part is very detailed, the other part isn't so detailed. I.e. one is higer-poly, and one is lesser-poly.

And this is where problems start...
Some triangles (even if they're covered with a non-null texture) still appear invisible.
But, other than that, I haven't had any major problems with triangular terrain.

Mmm, yeah. There's 1 additional problem. This long compile time is in fact very needy and greedy.
I compiled ts_untergrund with fast HlVis. triggers everyone
So, when I'm standing on one specific place, all the entities go invisible.

-----------------------------------

I only experienced these problems:

- Long compile time (although, I am patient and willing to wait :3)

Well, I have an almost-10-year-old laptop! Of course it takes forever. I wonder, though, how quick would the Core i3-6100 do the job. ;D
________________________

- Some missing faces (not a HlVis bug)

I don't know. Locate the brush and cover it entirely with non-null textures? I can always try.
________________________

- Invisible entities, if standing on a specific spot (fast HlVis)

This one could also be that the player exits the 4096^3 area, but I doubt that.
________________________

- Max clipnodes exceeded if I turn my terrain into a func_detail

So, the clipnodes one was fixed this way:
I selected it and turned on "passable". Then I copied the whole terrain on the same spot and covered the copied one in CLIP (only the top faces, the rest was in Bevel).
Yeah, much effort for a not-so-great improvement.
________________________

But still, us mappers can find a way out, most of the time. :3
Right?
16 Mar 17, 08:15
By Crypt
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120% sorry!
As a Source level designer, I cry at the idea of VIS taking more than a fraction of a second, let alone 15 days.
16 Mar 17, 09:05
By Solokiller
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Member
I remember when i first started mapping in Source and it took 30 minutes to compile the map. That was bad enough, but 15 days? How complex is this map?
16 Mar 17, 09:37
By Admer456
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Member
I was talking about GoldSource, not Source.
And it's true, compiling Source maps takes waaay less time than GoldSrc. grin - :D

I was so so surprised that 1 simple room with 1 light took like 2 seconds to compile for Source. Meanwhile, it takes longer for GoldSrc.

And hey, I usually wait 5 or 10 minutes for VIS, and then 30 to 40 minutes for RAD, for GoldSRC.
I guess that's what happens when you have a 10-year-old laptop with a 2.4GHz dual-core processor with 2GB of DDR2 (Shepard gets triggered) memory.

As for the map itself, let me find it...
It's basically a map from Rainbow Six: Siege ported to CS 1.6.
16 Mar 17, 11:40
By rufee
avatar
Sledge fanboy
I think the problem with GS compiling is that the compilers themselves are old and unoptimized. Basically built on top of quake compilers used in the first versions of GS.

Someone could really do a rewrite for them instead of making "yet another goldsource renderer" smile - :)

And if someone could point me in the right direction that explains the whole process in detail i would appreciate it a lot.
16 Mar 17, 12:01
By abbadon
avatar
Member
I remember that one of my old CS maps (de_caceres) took 39 hours to compile on a P4 3.2 Ghz laptop with 1 GB Ram 400 mhz. Headcrab Basher - :crowbar: The poor bitch was almost fried because of it!!
16 Mar 17, 13:09
By Admer456
avatar
Member
Wait, a Pentium 4 with 3.2GHz!? I only thought they were around 2GHz. tongue - :P

Yeah, I wonder what if someone makes a GoldSrc version, of the Source compilers? Then some people could easily take incorporate the Lightmap Scale option into a map editor, for example.

And, there's one thing I must say during compiling:
NEVER SET PRIORITY TO 'REALTIME' DURING COMPILING.
Always remember this. This applies to hlcsg, hlbsp, hlvis and hlrad.

Basically, the "realtime" priority is only for the mouse and the keyboard, i.e. the main input devices! If you choose to set the priority to real-time then your mouse, keyboard and the entire system might freeze.
It happened to me once. :3
16 Mar 17, 13:26
By rufee
avatar
Sledge fanboy
I wouldn't recommend even -high, tested Tremplers Stalkfire on my i7-7700k, with compilers set at high i got only a 10 sec gain from compiling on -low (which is the default for vhlt) the PC was unusable during that time.
16 Mar 17, 13:31
By Admer456
avatar
Member
Yeah, I tried HlRad with -high.
My laptop was suffering, and I had to kill hlrad.exe. unhappy - :(

So yeah, I guess that we came to a conclusion:
If you want a detailed, outdoors map, just be patient and wait until it finishes.

What jacksepticeye said: "Speed is key!" is false.
16 Mar 17, 17:59
By Bruce
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Member
lightmap scale has nothing to do with the compilers or the editor, its in the engine
16 Mar 17, 18:12
By Admer456
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Member
Huh, I didn't know that.
16 Mar 17, 20:08
By Dr. Orange
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Member
Quote:
lightmap scale has nothing to do with the compilers or the editor, its in the engine

Lightmap scale do affect the compile time, since a lower lightmap scale requires more calculations on a single surface. Lightmaps can therefore be optimized where high quality lighting isn't required, or in low-contrast light areas.
16 Mar 17, 20:09
By Dr. Orange
avatar
Member
Quote:
lightmap scale has nothing to do with the compilers or the editor, its in the engine

Lightmap scale do affect the compile time, since a lower lightmap scale requires more calculations on a single surface. Lightmaps can therefore be optimized where high quality lighting isn't required, or in low-contrast light areas.
16 Mar 17, 20:29
By Shepard62700FR
avatar
Member
@rufee : if I had experience with multi-threading, GPU computing, CSG, BSP, VIS and RAD I would have looked at it.
16 Mar 17, 21:14
By Solokiller
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Member
Last time i looked into the compiler code i saw a lot of platform specific code using ancient APIs. You can redesign them from scratch more quickly than updating them.
16 Mar 17, 21:24
By abbadon
avatar
Member
Wow!, instead of ZHLT there will be PSCT!! (Power Source Compiling Tools). grin - :D
16 Mar 17, 21:37
By Admer456
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Member
I vote for: GPCT!
(Gold Polyhedron Compiling Tools)

Coming in 1st April, 2033, at 4:20 PM., exactly when Half-Life 3 releases. (OK, you could ignore these 2 sentences because it's a joke xD)

I don't know, it sounds cool!
BSP-based mapping (CSG should be appropriate, too) is basically about polyhedrons. So, I think it's OK.
17 Mar 17, 04:33
By James Luke
avatar
Member
Yeah, I was having a good look at the terrain capabilities in Source and trying to mimic them in Goldsource.

May have gotten way in over my head with this project. REALLY way in over my head.

But it did get me thinking.

Aside from the pain in the ASS that is PARANOIA's renderer and meaningless code in the old SDK. I decided to start having a look at the interface system Valve left in.

I also looked into Half-Life 2's code and saw the same thing...but for physics objects/collisions/terrain. What if we could mount the HL2 .dlls into Half-Life 1 and be able to do basic terrain or physics collisions. Kinda like what Solokiller is doing with VGUI2 in HLEnhanced? Is this possible? I think it would require a massive overhaul with Vectors and all that stuff...but maybe someday?

Say drag the .dll over and extract the interface version/names and use the CBaseGameInterface from HLEnhanced to hook the .dlls over and bring out the functionality to at least get something to work, like building a physics-mesh and seeing it or seeing displacements. Obviously implying it will have it's own interface file.

On another note, might have to ditch the renderer and wait for a better one. Or maybe switch to Trinity. Or at least the client-side entity manager.

EDIT: But we should have a cleaned-up version of VHLT that is optimized. Sure mappers could use that and get way better performance.
17 Mar 17, 08:14
By Shepard62700FR
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Member
I don't think you can use HL2 DLLs within HL1
17 Mar 17, 12:52
By Solokiller
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Member
That'll never work because you'd need the engine to implement support for it.
17 Mar 17, 13:48
By Crypt
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120% sorry!
Meanwhile, Source is just... there. To use. Like, for free.

But nah, why use Source for it's features when you can try to make a bastardized version instead
17 Mar 17, 15:05
By rufee
avatar
Sledge fanboy
Im also kind of against all of these hacked up clone engines. But it is what it is.
We are just stuck in the past apparently smile - :)
17 Mar 17, 15:11
By Archie
avatar
My Empire of Dirt
1000x this ^
17 Mar 17, 16:34
By Solokiller
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Member
There wouldn't be any clones if Valve did their job.
17 Mar 17, 16:51
By James Luke
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Member
I wouldn't exactly say were stuck in the past.

It's just fun to find out what we can do with an old engine.

Like 5 minutes after posting that I just had a look in the source and saw there were calls in the engine. unhappy - :(

But if Valve stopped being lazy and released the engine already, then might it be possible? I wouldn't doubt it would require an overhaul and would be impractical, but maybe?
17 Mar 17, 17:06
By Solokiller
avatar
Member
If the engine were open source then anything is possible.
But i'd say the first thing to add would be an interface to query for available features, or all the different forks will end up making a mess (Gold-Life has displacements, Half-Source has 3D skyboxes, etc).

Too many forks will kill modding just like not having the engine source.
17 Mar 17, 17:08
By Dr. Orange
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Member
What if Valve secretly wants us to use Source and phase out GoldSource?
17 Mar 17, 17:18
By Solokiller
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Member
Then they should say so instead of keeping it a secret. I am tired of people keeping secrets for no reason in this community.

I sent another email to Valve, this time stressing that i will consider a lack of reply or vague/generic reply to mean we can do whatever we want. Now is not the time for secrets, it is the time for progress.
17 Mar 17, 17:18
By James Luke
avatar
Member
They've certainly neglected it at least.

Last Github commit: Latest commit 5d76170 on Dec 30, 2014. And I can't remember the last Steam update for it except the beta. And they say they are only fixing critical game-breaking bugs. If that.
17 Mar 17, 17:27
By rufee
avatar
Sledge fanboy
Yes, but at some point the new updated engine would go too far out of scope to be even called GoldSource anymore.

I am a purist in this sense that i believe all the bugs, limitations and everything else is what GoldSource truly is and should not be messed with, if this is why Valve is not releasing the code then i applaud them. Even if they would what would happen? Suddenly all the bugs would be fixed? I doubt it, i can bet you Valve would be too lazy to release the updated version on Steam anyway. Last i checked unless you are a die hard Russian non-steam HL player whatever the majority of players are on Steam. Look at Id Software, they release all their old engine's, sure there's a ton of mods, but if someone plays them its probably the original game. Its the same here.

Even if i sound like a crusader for 1 engine i have nothing against all of you who do make these engines, it proves that you know what you are doing, but i believe your skills and talents are better put to use somewhere else.
17 Mar 17, 17:37
By Solokiller
avatar
Member
I suppose that's why people wanted to run their mods under Svengine, until they broke compatibility and everybody had to go back to the old one. They were happy to finally get past the ridiculous limits and bugs, and then the rug got pulled out from under them.
17 Mar 17, 23:02
By Shepard62700FR
avatar
Member
I'm just gonna leave those here :

Server redirection exploit (AMXX example) - Reported 9 Feb 2014 - NOT FIXED

Recent Update: DayofDefeat crashes after some time with SegmentationFault (Linux) - Reported 20 Dec 2015 - NOT FIXED

Console command "speak *anysoundfile" will crash game - Reported 27 Oct 2015 - NOT FIXED

https://github.com/ValveSoftware/halflife/i
ssues/1622
- Reported 25 May 2015 - PATCH STILL WAITING TO BE ACCEPTED FOR EVERYONE TO USE

Add all the dangling pointers, memory leaks, crashes tickets reported by Solokiller and you'll see that Gold Source is starting to be messy.

Quote:
if this is why Valve is not releasing the code then i applaud them.
Quote from here :
Quote:
Once a year someone talks about maybe pulling it together to open source it but once again there are not resources to do the actual work need to package it up. The Sven Co-op team was luck in that there was a package and someone to make it available to them, that does not exist today.


Quote:
i can bet you Valve would be too lazy to release the updated version on Steam anyway
You are right, Valve can't monitor 540545640 versions of Gold Source. But developers can provide the changes as some kind of "unofficial patch/port" like ezQuake, Darkplaces does for QuakeWorld. Those who prefer to stick on standard Gold Source stick to Steam, those who want more stuff would look to these ports.
18 Mar 17, 03:58
By DiscoStu
avatar
Member
@Victor933: That is one lovely level crossing. My only nitpick is that the signal lights are wrong* ;P

While I was watching the video I heard a sweet distant train horn as the lights changed, I thought it was amazing sound work and went back to hear it again... and it wasn't there. Went back and forth several times and I couldn't find it. Turns out I heard an actual train in the distance out my window.

*Wrong means: The one on the left is red because duh, there's a train coming. But the one on the right should be green, signalling clear to the train, otherwise the train should stop right there or it would most likely crash onto another train that's either stopped ahead, or worse, coming in on the same track in the opposite direction.
19 Mar 17, 03:37
By Victor-933
avatar
Member
@DiscoStu
Quote:
My only nitpick is that the signal lights are wrong* ;P


The signals do change. They switch to yellow first, then green, then switch back to red as the engine passes.
19 Mar 17, 04:38
By DiscoStu
avatar
Member
In my defense I was too distracted by OMG TRAINS
19 Mar 17, 20:57
By rufee
avatar
Sledge fanboy
Quote:
Once a year someone talks about maybe pulling it together to open source it but once again there are not resources to do the actual work need to package it up. The Sven Co-op team was luck in that there was a package and someone to make it available to them, that does not exist today.


Someone made it available, who's that someone? 5 min question for Valve to ask internally. If Valve's intentions are to open source it and only sven has the code then get the code from sven... (Has no one thought about this?)

While the ability to execute commands on the client side is an ethical concern and should not be done. The command is there and therefore is a feature which can be used for things like redirecting players around or worse. Ive though many times to write a server reverse proxy for my needs.

I seem not to be able to stop derailing this WIP thread unhappy - :(
19 Mar 17, 21:27
By Solokiller
avatar
Member
Alfred provided it. I've asked him multiple times already. I've also pointed out that they could get it back from the SC team to no avail. The Cry Of Fear team wanted to help and contacted Valve and got the same reply.

They just plain don't care. The open sourcing statements, the "we made it easy but won't because exploits" stuff is just a bunch of excuses. That's all you'll get in this community these days.
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Forums > Maps and Mods

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