Team Mapping Created 12 years ago2012-03-09 07:50:59 UTC by Captain Terror Captain Terror

Created 12 years ago2012-03-09 07:50:59 UTC by Captain Terror Captain Terror

Posted 12 years ago2012-04-24 00:48:47 UTC Post #305667
Aw ok then, Sir Blitzkrieg, the map is yours for the last edit slot :)

after you are done and i've added a final optimization pass, we should be ready for beta release hopefully, bar some testing!
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-24 10:22:54 UTC Post #305676
Ok! So is that one posted on the page back the proper version, or does someone have it still?
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-24 22:05:58 UTC Post #305678
yeppers, it's the same one that Tet would have gotten:
Team_mapping_018a

Keep in mind a few things archie noticed in your edit if you remember, else i can do it ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-25 18:41:32 UTC Post #305683
[edit]donesies! http://localhostr.com/file/vzeCXKF/team_mapping_019.zip

Ok! All im gonna do is add my graffs then do a fast compile, ill do it in a few hours when i get home from work and then i'll re-up.

[edot] oh, and I'll fix those couple of nodrawed faces, although i honestly have no clue how they got there. I'm sure I'd have noticed if my own building was nodraw'd when I compiled to look at it.

I'm doing a fast compile, just so I can screenie the few sprays I placed and put the shots here. There is a reason for this, SO READ IT NOW:

IF I TAGGED YOUR BUILDING, AND YOU DISAGREE WITH YOUR BUILDING BEING TAGGED, SAY SO HERE.

Ok so only 3 buildings that aren't mine got graffs. here they are:
User posted image
User posted image
User posted image
sneaky boxman is with the boxes
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-25 20:04:08 UTC Post #305691
Nice! Add in some random tags/scribbles all over the place to get the messy urban look going. Usually for each big piece, a writer would also leave at least 3-5 tags in the area. Lots of maps overlook that. ;)
Daubster DaubsterVault Dweller
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-25 22:24:46 UTC Post #305705
Lovin' it Blitz dowlnoading now! And those nulls on your building were probably collateral damage(my fault) when i was optimizing, sorry! ;)

Everybody: expect a few more days of optimization(at least) before we are ready for a beta release.

ALSO maybe start thinking about a name and how we should release the map, i.e. i can post the map on mapping sites(gamebanana, twhl(obv), moddb, etc) as captain terror and list everyone as co-authors, OR i can make up a username like TWHL Team Mapping or some such, and we'd all be listed as co-authors.

Archie: if you can post up your radfile for the prop shadows that would be amazing, else i can round up all the prop names outside the map myself for textureshadows.
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-25 22:28:28 UTC Post #305706
Cap't can you do me one favor? can you move boxman down so he starts at the grass, and then shrink him so that he's as tall as the pile of boxes? It will be epic.

I had just assumed you would post it around and list us all as the authors, but now I like the idea of a TeamTWHL account posting them. I never thought of that!

As for a name, that is a better question. What direction do we even go with that?

And Daub, I tagged one of the graffs. My gun half-covers it and it's really small. I didn't want to plaster MY name all over OUR map! :heart:
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-26 13:53:09 UTC Post #305707
Sure blitz the boxman cometh =)

Cstriker: i you'd like me to try and integrate your underground section to the map, send me a link an i'll see what i can do ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-26 19:56:53 UTC Post #305747
Sent you a link. I don't know how other members would feel about this... I mean, the tunnel is huge. Most of it would have to remain as simple scenery and somehow establish a shorter path.

Blitzkrieg, can you do a decal with the Steam logo which says "THE VAPOURIZED DIHYDROGEN MONOXIDE VIDEO GAMING DEVICE"? This one is by Scotch. That'd be awesome :D.

Also, excuse me for noticing SO LATE, but what's this thread doing in the General Discussion category?
Striker StrikerI forgot to check the oil pressure
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-26 22:32:55 UTC Post #305751
Sure, if Cap't doesn't mind sticking it up somewhere then I can do it tomorrow when I get back from work and I'll send it to him.
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-27 06:30:02 UTC Post #305757
I never compiled with textureshadows. Tried once and it crashed RAD, probably due to the chain link fences. You could just add the trees if you want. StaticPropShadows is really enough, imo.

Awesome tags, Blitz. If you still have the PSDs, though, I would personally get rid of the backgrounds of images 1 & 2. Looks too much like "this is the square material's workable space" whereas the bottom one has a more natural border with the bikini-clad girl.

Amazing work.
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-27 14:51:58 UTC Post #305777
yeppers blitz np.

Archie: okkk that's fine. I you still have the radfile tho i could dick around with it, perhaps try removing the more complicated ones like you said.
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-27 15:36:32 UTC Post #305778
That is indeed a very good idea Archie. I also noticed that I went too close to the border on the mouth one, and you can actually see a little hard edge. As long as we've got time and I don't need to rush then I could fix those. I guess I could do that spray for Scotch when I fix them. Which probably won't be today. I'm not feelin it right now. I'm lazy :(

Also, are there any set sizes that I should be using for overlays, or does Source handle odd dimensions well? I've been making them 512x512 for simplicity's sake.
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-27 15:46:13 UTC Post #305779
Source2009 is limited to 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, 1024, 2048 or 4096, but it can be either by either, e.g. 512 x 256.

Capt:
forcetextureshadow props/Nature/rd_newpalm01.mdl
forcetextureshadow props/Nature/rd_newpalm02.mdl
forcetextureshadow props/Nature/rd_newpalm03.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_dead01.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_dead02.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_dead03.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_dead04.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_dry01.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_dry02.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_pine_large.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_pine04.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_pine05.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_pine06.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_deciduous_01a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/tree_deciduous_02a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence001a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence001b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence001c.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence001d.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence001e.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence001g.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence002a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence002b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence002c.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence002d.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence002e.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence002f.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence003a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence003b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence003d.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence003e.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence003f.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence004a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/interior_fence004b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_barb_256.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_barb_512.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_border_128.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_border_256.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_border_512.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_trail_128.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_trail_256.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fence_trail_512.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence_notbarbed002a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence_notbarbed002b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence_notbarbed002c.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence_notbarbed002d.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence_notbarbed002e.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence_notbarbed002f.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence001a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence001b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence002a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence002b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence002c.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence002d.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence002e.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence003a.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_wasteland/exterior_fence003b.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/fern01.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/ferns01.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/ferns02.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_foliage/ferns03.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fern01.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_forest/fern01lg.mdl
forcetextureshadow props_c17/fence03a.mdl
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-27 15:51:51 UTC Post #305781
:heart:

I also might dick with the navgation mesh since i've been wanting to learn how to underp it, so if you have some useful related tips/links, that would be much appreciatied :)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-27 16:03:13 UTC Post #305782
No links, I figured it out by messing with L4D.
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-29 06:44:21 UTC Post #305815
So, any news?
Striker StrikerI forgot to check the oil pressure
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-29 15:15:13 UTC Post #305827
hopefully I can finish it up when I get home today. if the areaportals don't work, we may have to discuss options to make the fps more playable mid map.
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-29 23:49:19 UTC Post #305837
I'm open to that. I want to give this thing a fighting chance at being really fun to play, and I think we're on the right track.
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-30 01:42:02 UTC Post #305838
Optimization Update
With the use of very simple func_areaportals, already boosted the fps back to pre-2nd pass speeds, and Many area speeds vastly improved:

97% walkable map: +60 fps
75-80% walk. map: +75-115
65-75% walk. map: +135

The center of the map is the only problem area left, with some areas dropping briefly as low as low 50 in fps. Some of the outer corners of the map will drop mid forties, but i don't expect heavy combat in the majority of these places.

NOW, i'm experimenting with hints with some promising results, and i have more advanced func_areaportal tricks to try, as well func_areaportal_window.

More Optimization Ideas (please add any input you may have!):
-reduce number of overlays
-reduce or eliminate prop_physics_multiplayers
-reduce prop_static
-make some windows(specially the tth building)opaque for more effective areaportals/hints
-???

I'll continue work on this tomorrow when i get home from work, Night! :P
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-30 06:55:34 UTC Post #305840
The center of the map is the only problem area left, with some areas dropping briefly as low as low 50 in fps. Some of the outer corners of the map will drop mid forties, but i don't expect heavy combat in the majority of these places.
CT, I think these values are really ok. What specs are you running this map on? I am aware that a lot of people still have wooden pcs, but then a lot of people also have powerful pcs here on TWHL. And something that's above 40fps is really... playable.
Striker StrikerI forgot to check the oil pressure
Posted 12 years ago2012-04-30 11:09:43 UTC Post #305845
well i have fps drop down in some areas, 40 fps~ its freezing a little maybe because the map is so open area ^^
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 17:40:11 UTC Post #305851
Here is teaser to check out the current optimization progress:
User posted image
Team_mapping_019e

This is the best performance i've been able to get so far.

Fps is playable, but my goal is to eliminate the lag at the center of the map and reach say, +80 everywhere. (my original goal was +100 everywhere)

Of course, if you-all think it's ok as-is, i will wrap it up and release for testing ;)

Cstriker
i'm getting weird reflections from your poster, even after building cubemaps and restarting... any idea how to fix?

Blitz
still need those updated overlays. i erased the big one on the tth building cuz like archie said, it doesn't really match and looks like a big square. If you can fade/blend it out like the bikini one i'll reinclude it. I may have nixed one more also but i can't remember, but i think the giraffe one may need to be blended a little too, or i can leave it. (no big deal) ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:30:00 UTC Post #305868
Ok! Fixing now.
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:35:52 UTC Post #305869
i'm getting weird reflections from your poster, even after building cubemaps and restarting... any idea how to fix?
It looks like a decal. There's a model version which should work better. If the problem persists you can assign a cubemap to a specific brush face (the one under the poster) to force it to use that.
Also, make sure you're quitting the game then starting it again after building cubemaps. CSS still bugs out occasionally when displaying reflections after an HDR cubemap build.

Did you fix the breakable_surfs?
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:40:53 UTC Post #305870
yeah i don't know what i did, but they showing up on both sides now ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:41:08 UTC Post #305871
I've got two repaired alpha channels for a Mr. Terror here, get 'em while they're hot! http://localhostr.com/file/6CPRatt/blitzgraff_fixedalphachannel.zip
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:43:45 UTC Post #305872
they sometimes don't render properly with fast vis compiles. Could that be the culprit?

edit:
Not you blitz, I'm sure your alphas render beautifully no matter what the compile settings <3
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:47:54 UTC Post #305873
<3

Now i don't even mind being edit blocked, Cap't, feel free to move these graphs anywhere. Now that I think of it back in T spawn with the other graffiti makes a bit more sense. That would allow you to cut down on overlays too, if 3 of the vanilla graffs get deleted to make room for each of these, that's 6 less overlays in the area.

A sunny wall is better than a shaded wall, but its by no means required :)
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-01 18:56:02 UTC Post #305874
I never compile with fast vvis not ever ;) And thanks for the model tip for the poster, i'll use that instead.

Blitz: cool man will be checking these out soon =)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-03 00:28:50 UTC Post #305903
Would like to give everyone an opportunity to test/play the map before I start the finishing touches, and we can release as beta.

Team_mapping_019g
Team_Mapping_019g (packbsp'd)

Finishing Touches
-Overview
-cameras
-navigation mesh
-implement texture shadows(still haven't messed with them at all yet)
-include striker's sewer(this will probably not make the beta version)

Also, has anyone thought about a name and a story for the mapname.txt?
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-03 01:25:52 UTC Post #305904
A small, crazed, wayward ultra-conservative militia takes hostage the operators of a porn studio based on moral stances. The city block is evacuated and police approach from the next block over via the sewers in order to save the producers.

ah, i think i gave you an incorrect file for one of the sprays.
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-03 06:18:33 UTC Post #305905
I only changed out the giraffe overlay, so I apologiz and will make sure the rest are updated as well ;)

how u feel about the fps blitz, u think it's good enough for online play?

edit
dang it, i LOVE the VDC.. :P
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 09:46:44 UTC Post #305966
@ Blitz

http://i.imgur.com/1Oz90.jpg

Sexy Parodius? xD
Stojke StojkeUnreal
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 17:20:38 UTC Post #305971
Explain! I wiki'd it and I still can't figure it out, lol. I WANNA GET THE JOKE.
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 17:24:17 UTC Post #305972
joe mamma gets it! joe-mamma-joe-mamma-joe-mamma :P
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 17:50:44 UTC Post #305973
lol. Ok so seriously, can we get serious and talk serious talk about the serious frame rates. Even though it's fine for us, and totally doesn't ruin our fun, when we release this into the sharktank of CS maps, it's going to turn players off. Honestly, we should get a prize for making a small Source engine map that runs worse than 64 player Battlefield 3.

How can we go about this? Duplicating the file and then removing whole sections, one at a time, to see which of the removed sections solves the problem? Then when we find the section, make it our collective mission to fix it while keeping it as true to the original work? I would be fine with my work being reconstructed if it turned out to be the problem, but I don't know if everyone else feels that way. We would really need everyone to be on board before we tried.

Thoughts?
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 18:19:25 UTC Post #305974
dude, i asked you how the fps was and you said it was "smooth"?! So what are you on about now?

One commenter on gamebanana said the only problem area for fps was by the ct spawn..

as for what to do, i can make all the windows on the tth building opaque and close the garage doors in favor for entrances on the side, and that should halp a little, since you can't really use effective areaportals or hints on that building in it's current state.

If we eliminated the alley windows from the corporate office that would help too, because archie's props in there are rendered almost all of the time despite my efforts at hinting.

we can also reduce overlay and prop models across the board. Other than putting a big schoolbus or something in the middle to block vis, i don't really see what else we can do, but i'm surely open to suggestions!
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 18:26:26 UTC Post #305975
Ok, so it sounds like it's not really one big thing but a few little things. That's good! Honestly all of those things sound reasonable, but I want to wait to hear what everyone else thinks.

And yeah CT spawn is the only problem area, and it's not even all the time. But when you stand in the middle, you can see nearly everywhere.

And I did say it was fine! It is fine for me! I'm suggesting that other players, who didn't contribute to this and have as much fun with it as we are are, are definitely going to notice it.
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 18:55:56 UTC Post #305976
We are obviously building this so other people can play it.

Not like it's your fault, since nobody else dropped feedback on the fps when i posted the "proof" map anyway. O-well we can make changes no problem if we decide it's needed ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 21:24:46 UTC Post #305977
To be honest I think it's great that you guys are actually worrying about performance on lesser machines then your own. I know it's a multiplayer map but still this kind of optimization and performance is something that I would expect to get neglected by most people.
Crollo CrolloTrollo
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 21:37:06 UTC Post #305978
Agreed collapse, but it's especially an issue cuz the center of the map is essentially wide open.

Blitz: just thought of something i can try quick that may have some impact without cutting anything; i'll just turn down the fade distnace on the props in the garage and office and see what happens :)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-05 22:51:06 UTC Post #305979
Remember not to make the fade distance of "essential cover" low enough that it will disappear within eyeline of potential snipers.

I get a constant 60fps in all areas with Vsync on. Over a hundred with it off. If low-end machines are only dropping to 40 then I don't really think there's an issue. 40 is totally playable, especially if it's only in one area.

Also, gotta say I think it's a bit premature releasing it on 'lopers and gamebanana - especially without proper screenshots...
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-06 00:15:12 UTC Post #305980
Well, it was branded "Beta". I do stand by my previous suggestion that the last compile be done by Archie. And I didn't have my fps counter on, but I noticed slowdowns and it's hardly and old computer.
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-06 01:46:52 UTC Post #305981
reuploaded with hdr/ldr final. (yes i missed that too!)

Sorry i uploaded it too soon fellas! i thought everyone was getting bored and/or losing interest, as basically me and blitz were the only ones being active recently. Apologize for my impatience!

You-all think should we take it down and reup when it's ready?

Also, i'm completely fine with Arch doing the final compile if he would like to do it ;)

Oh and BTW, lowering the fade distances did nothing for fps unfortunately =(

Edit
Updated the screenies on GameBanana and Interlopers.
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-06 13:41:27 UTC Post #305988
Explain! I wiki'd it and I still can't figure it out, lol. I WANNA GET THE JOKE.
If that was at me, sexy parodius game has a boss name Hot Lips which is a giant mouth:
http://sdb.drshnaps.com/display.php?object=11866
Stojke StojkeUnreal
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-06 15:41:42 UTC Post #305991
Ha! I was on the right track with the game but didn't know about the boss and he wasn't on wiki, that's some funny stuff. Eerily similar!
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-06 16:52:46 UTC Post #305992
Haha yeah, even the gold tooth is on the same spot :D
Awesome.
Stojke StojkeUnreal
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-07 14:47:48 UTC Post #306019
TWHLers! Please support us on GameBanana with a rate/comment if you can!

A couple more rates and we can easily hold top map for the fortnight, and then maybe the month, increasing exposure for this twhl and the map ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 12 years ago2012-05-08 10:13:28 UTC Post #306028
Gamenaner won't let me make an account :( I'll try again with another email in a bit.
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