i cant take anymore! Created 20 years ago2004-06-23 13:16:55 UTC by ministeve

the quality (or lack of it) in the vault ahs gone way too far. could we put like an 8 day wait before you can post maps or summin?

Very bad idea. Then no one would upload maps anymore. The vault made for everyone to upload his maps. It is not made to provide quality maps only.
If you have a problem with the quality, why don't you push it up a bit by posting own high quality maps?

That will go against the vault's "moral vision"

i meant for new users. when ppl join they hav 2 wait 8 days 4 they can post a map.

TWHL is for everybody.
Image you'd travel to a foreign country and there they tell you to stay at home the first week because you're new there. That's pretty much the same.
Everyone must have a chance to make mistakes, even if it annoys others.

still, too many people are making mistakes. maybe just 3 days. anyway if u had 2 stay home a week u could use that time 2 read the tuts and map rather than mapping for an hour and thowing it all on twhl.

This wouldn't fair. Just because you have a problem with the quality of the maps, we cannot limit access this way. I've seen no one else here who was equaly annoyed by this.
Why don't you look at the profile of the map posters, if he's "older" than a week, you give him a chance, otherwise not.

the map vault was made to show peoples maps, not things they threw together in an hour or just came to twhl to put up and never come back.

Everybody has his reasons for doing things like that.
You cannot change that, if you can't take it, try to ignore it.

it can be changed, we can have a waiting time. i just dont like people abusing twhl's facilities.

Maybe a way to filter inactive members' maps depending on personal preference? I don't really mind. I only look when I'm bored and I don't expect anything particularly decent.

make them put the crap in there own little map vault, like a noob vault. I don't see why they don't put it in the unfinished.

How do you want to call it?
'Noobs who have just registered-mapvault'?
Hey no one even sticks to the map type, there are awfully many counterstrike maps that are marked to be HL.
This would not work either. I think you'll have to tollerate it.
Still not all the maps are total crap, every once in a while someone uploads something good.

you could have an Advanced Vault and a Beginer Vault, just to not insult too many people. some noob would put there stuff in Advanced, but it would help.

It'd discriminate people with less skill.
The noob vault would be ignored because nobody will expect good maps there. So, after a while everybody would put his stuf into the advanced vault, because they want comments on their maps.
Then we'd be back at the beginning again.

I'd look at teh noob stuff! I'm here to help, although you could consider me a Noob.

its a noob eat noob world out there.

Im in disagreement with Ministeve here, an 8 day or 3 day ban from posting maps for noobs wont really solve your bad mapped maps problem. These noobs are here to create something and are free to put what ever they come up with into the map vault. No crime in that!
However, to solve the problem of increase "crap maps" instead of an 8 day BAN, i think we need to put a "Compulsery Rating Process" on every map that is posted. This means when a map is published/uploaded there will be a "rateing poll" for people to vote for what rating they think the map deserves. This could happen for a period of three - four days, after that depending on the rating, the map will either be kept or deleted. Lets say the rating it must score above is 3/5 or 6/10, anything below these figures and the map is deleted after the voting period. If a map gets no votes them obviously it is deleted and the creator will have to upload it again and get people to look at it. Lets put a minimum or 10 people must vote for it to be considered.

Just an idea, could work. Im personally happy with how things are now, I dont publish maps untill i have them just right and if i do want to pubish a crap map it goes to unfinished and i get people to comment on them. I think Ministeve's concern for high standard work is important, we dont want to be getting a reputation for bad maps.

TWAIN

That's an interesting idea.

It's not a bad idea, but it wouldn't work.
Most people here are too lazy to look at every new map and give a rating.
Second thing is that you would have to ensure that only people who are able to judge on things in a quite objective way. What if someonw who really hates the creator of that certain map comes up and drops a zero points rating. It'd be quite hard for an average map to get back into the tolerance range again.

We already have a rating system. Though it seems to be quite messy.
I have two questions about it.
1st: can not-members of TWHL rate maps? I think this should be a priviledge for members.
2nd: can one person vote more than once? If so, it should be changed, too. That way you ensure a quite objective result.
Also the author of the map should not be allowed to rate it.

I think if we could change the current reating system that way, it'd become a very reliable quality ensurance.

A person can vote more than once... I found out after someone has rated 'Detention' over a hundred times with 1 star... Something that should get changed in my opinion.

I like the Snarkpit's rating system, e.g. you can only rate when you post a comment, the rating is shown at the lower-right of the post.

As for TWHL, I see this site more as a starters place for beginning mappers. When you want more quality maps you'd better go out and search for other mapping sites. I mean, you can't force people to make quality...

I see this site more as a starters place for beginning mappers

Same.

Since this hasn't got a 'submit' system, where maps are checked by admins, it attracts beginners.

thats a sweet idea actually twain.

btw hazardous, ive hardly seen anything on these forums positive posted by u. lighten up man!

another idea is a page brought up when u register giving u the jist on twhl and the basic rules. if it didnt look much like just a load of legal stuff people would read it. i admnit some people will skip through it but its really only to be expected.

/me waits for hazardous's negative reply...

Hm? Maybe that's because I'm a pessimist.
But I allways try to explain my negative replies. So you can understand why I think so.
Mostly it because I've seen all this before and it never went good.
So I try to think of another solution for the problem.
/me hopes that this wayn't too negative

lol, dont worry, its getting better. take my outlook on life, the happy pessimist. life sucks, get over it.

I'm not sooo pessimist.
I'm just like a 'I'll die anyway and no one will remember me, so why should I bring efforts' - pessimist.
Btw, I believe that pessimists live longer than optimists.
'Lalala, life is fun, I will walk over that street now without getting over-' CRASH!

lol, i believe optimists are a lil niave, but pessimists just get annoying. go for the middle ground, or even be a sadist.

so why should I bring efforts

For your own sake. Make the most of the little you have!

I do. My problem is that I usually get very lazy when I have to do things that are not in my interrest at all.
I'm afraid I've led this thread offtopic again. Oh, I am so useless.

sorry this is a bit of topic but are you mop of wws? :

I think it's fine like it is, except maybe better searching and more mod types.

yes but there is person on wws called muppet there http://www.weeweeslap.com/forum/about.asp

Hey, don't do publicity for another community here!
@7th: Wouldn't it be possible to write a little program that unzips the files, looks for a mod specific entity in the bsp and then puts into the right cathegory automatically?

TFC is pretty popular, but not many mapper for it. Just saying.

Refering to what Hazardous said earlier,
I have seen the holes in the voting idea, there would have to be a 'one vote per map per member' policy/system so that people dont vote for themselves a whole lot of times.

"What if someonw who really hates the creator of that certain map comes up and drops a zero points rating." -Hazardous
is some cases this would only be the one person voting and out of the ten member minimum, it should not effect the end vote that much. But another way to deal with this problem is to post the map anomous untill the 3 day or 5 day voting period is up. If the map makes it to be published on the web site the creators name is also published with the map. So members do not know who they are voting for and will souly vote on the maps appearence and performance.

If this fails to work, we can disignate 5-10 members who have an judging opinion, regardless who the creator is, and they can be the ones to judge the maps. At the same time other members can download the maps, just not vote on them.

Just Adding to the idea. I do like MOP's idea of different categories for each Mod. I was thinking maybe also a custom Mod section where Members publish their own custom built Modifications.

TWAIN

Umm, haven't we already been over this a few times?
Anyway, I must say that I am impressed by those of you that understand that TWHL is for everyone.
Well Done.

I believe the Vault is due some serious restructuring but must again state the original intention of the Vault:
A place for all mappers to show their work regardless of skill.

I have to be blunt with those of you that do not share this vision.... If you don't want to download heaps of "below (your) standard" maps, then DONT download them.

A good indicator to spot maps worth downloading is that the author actually bothered to post a screenie, and give a meaningful description of the map.

Until such time that Atom decides to revamp the Vault, you will have to put up with the madness....

OMG - are we on THIS again?

Ministeve, you being the one to complain about the map vault comes as a big surprise. My intention is not to insult you sir, but to tell you that people try the best they can. Being a NEWBIE at mapping, I have been trying to learn a lot before placing any finished works in there myself, for the simple fact that people DO complain.

TWHL map vault is a cool place *I* think... low or high skills, I see it as a place for learning ideas and skills.

YES YES!

That one post changed my mind.

major, is that any reference to my last map? people thought it was pretty crap, but i spent weeks putting together some of the ent setups on that. it may have turned out crap, but at least i put alot of time into it.

See, that's what newbies do.
They often spend hours for quite simple stuff. They try getting help in forums, try to fix it themselves etc.
When they finished their map after lots of pain in the arse and weeks spent on browsing different forums, they are proud of what the've done, no matter how it looks. Of course they want to show their first success to others, and then they come here.

i didint go runnig round forums looking for help! ffs, i took time to make things work! what made it crap was that the map style wouldnt work well on an oldre engine!

I was talking about the hours of work you put into that map.
No matter how you spent it, it was hard and afterwards you're proud of what you've created in hours and hours of hard work.

i didint go runnig round forums looking for help!

umm, isn't this what TWHL is for? to help people in mapping? for a community of mappers to progress together, teaching each other? isn't that what the forums are for?

its ok to run around the forums looking for help, thats what there made for.

...so what part of that spoke out to you that i said it was in some way BAD to run around the forums asking for help?

none. I just wanted to say that

its ok to run around the forums looking for help, thats what there made for.

then i shall accept these terms.

It just annoys me when people create new forums for already answered questions. If i have a problem I look at the old forums and if I still dont understand, I post a reply in the old forums explaining what I don't understand. Its called recycling and it works just as well as posting a new forum except you have the preveous information from before to ask questions about.