Karate = Heavy Kung fu rumor Created 18 years ago2006-01-29 16:47:23 UTC by Madcow

A few weeks ago, a friend of mine told me that karate is just a rip of Heavy kung fu!
He talked about some guy from China (or maybe it was Okinawa in Japan), who travelled to the place where kung fu was invented.
Some guy teached him Heavy Kung fu, and then he returned to his home-country, he teached all in his village heavy kung fu, but he didn't call it "Heavy kung fu", he called it Karate.
he also said that he made it up.

I tried to find some info about this but I found nothing, therefore, I don't believe in this.
But do you know for sure that this is true or false?
What do you think?

now this is just silly

^^ he, he, great response!!

every now and again, some1 makes up something, to what they believe is true, becoz they've thought of it, and convinced themselved of it ... a likely case here!

That's about what I said, though I said it in swedish.

Well, he said he read it some where, but, nah..
Need more opinions though

Who the fuck cares?

@ZL: ... It's comon that some people looks for the truth, it lies in the human nature.

Who the fuck cares?

+1

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"Mythbusters to the rescue"?

Negative Saco:

Who the fuck cares?

I agree with ZL.What would happen if you just prove this is false or true?It would just stay in this forum.
Positive Saco:
But I think I understand your curiosity,there are some people who takes kung fu or karate lessons in TWHL.Tell them to ask their masters or teachers.

Karate means "empty hand" in Japanese (I am studying Japanese by the way). This is a very old Japanese word and if the man from Okinawa implemented Karate from Kung Fu (which is not a word in Japanese, they can't even spell the "ng"-sound) it must have happened a very long time ago (i'd say ~1000 years ago) and therefore it can only be considered a myth or tale.

Conclusion: If you could say that this is true, you could probably also prove that Jesus existed etc.

Kung fu and wushu are two popular Chinese terms that are commonly used as a synonym for Chinese martial arts. They appear by this use in many languages, including English and Chinese.
In legend, the Chinese martial arts trace their origin thousands of years into antiquity. As the Chinese writing system traces back to the Shang dynasty (1766 BC - 1122 BC), claims of entire books regarding the martial arts being written at earlier times are suspect. The Art of War, written during the 6th century BC by Sun Tzu, deals directly with military warfare. There are passages in the Zhuang Zi that pertain to the psychology and practice of martial arts. Zhuang Zi, the author of the same name, is believed to have lived in the 4th century BC. The Dao De Jing, often credited to Lao Zi, contains principles that are applicable to martial arts, but the dating of this work is controversial. According to some traditions, the reign of the legendary Yellow Emperor (traditional date of ascension to the throne, 2698 BC) introduced the earliest Chinese martial arts. The Yellow Emperor is described as a famous military general, who, before becoming China?s leader, wrote a lengthy treatise about martial arts. He is also credited with being the founder of China?s oldest known martial art ? chang quan (long fist). Furthermore, Taoist monks are claimed to have been practicing physical exercises that resemble Tai Chi (or a soft form of Kung fu) at least as early as the 500 BC era.

Karate is a mixture of indigenous Okinawan fighting arts and empty-handed Chinese fighting arts, the latter having been brought to Okinawa by political envoys, merchants, and sailors to and from Fujian Province. Estimates of the amount of Chinese influence vs. Okinawan influence in modern Karate vary considerably, from 40% Chinese/40% Okinawan/20% other to 80% Chinese/20% Okinawan. Some believe that there is also a Japanese jujutsu influence stemming from the long Japanese presence on Okinawa.

In 1722, Sakugawa, who had studied pugilism and staff fighting in China, started teaching a fighting art in the city of Shuri that he called "Karate-no-sakugawa." This was the first known recorded reference to the art of Karate (唐手) in a modern form. The word "Kara" (唐) referred to China itself, and "Te" (手) meant hand, in the sense of a style of fighting; so Karate meant "the Chinese techniques" or "Tang Hand".

Pwned by Wikipedia.

Well, if you believe in these texts then I guess the theory is true. They seem to be quite scientifically written so some of it is probably right anyway.

And as for the "kara" in Karate. Nowadays it has the meaning of "empty".

@ZL: Where did you find that information? (Thanks, btw)

and for Saco and J.C, Maybe I am intrested?
Sefish bastards.

"just because I don't care, this thread is pointless"?
Odd way to think.

Now when ZL has posted this text, 7th can close this thread, right?
So it won't get in to your way again...

and for Saco and J.C, Maybe I am intrested?
Sefish bastards.

Positive Saco:
But I think I understand your curiosity,there are some people who takes kung fu or karate lessons in TWHL.Tell them to ask their masters or teachers.

Thats why I put this in my post too.

Just because you care doesn't mean a topic worth to be posted here : this forum is already slowly dying (in my opinion), and if everybody post now his own "weird-topic-but-I-care-so-stfu" shit, the forum, which is supposed to be a space of ideas sharing, of discussions, will just die quickly, infested of off-topic topics with just some replies for each one, the point here is not that you have to care so it's ok, we know you care as you are the author, the point is to make that as much people as possible care about it, to make it really interesting ...

I am unemployed for years in France and am actually wondering if I move and work in Ireland, will I have to pay (income) taxes in France anyway or not (even if I don't live anymore in France, but still have the citizenship), but I know surely nobody here don't give a f#ck about that, then I don't post and just keep looking for the right persons to ask them ...

This stuff is just historian meat, it can not be proven and just provides endless and pointless discussions between "no-I-am-right!" persons (who have nothing better to do) : if you start that way, what about discuss about Jesus Christ as Manko said, about JFK, about the origins of the noodles (most say italian but some say chinese), of the gun powder (european or chinese?), who had the leadership in the prehistorical tribes (old, young, male, female), dinosaurs etc...

Kunkg fu and wushu are completely different. Wushu is meant to look exciting and cool, but is useless in a real fight. Kung fu can really kick someones ass. Wushu is basically fake kung fu, but it looks fun.

The Chinese were using noodles before italy. The chinese region was advanced way before mediterranean civilation.

Gunpowder was invented by the Chinese....der everyone knows this. Euopeans did NOT invent gunpowder. It's called trading...

Tribes were ruled differently based on where they were located. Greece had some very young people in power (Alexander), while the older tribes were usually controlled by older men. Some civilizations were governed by women, like the Minoans.

wow nice, what about my income tax now?

Well, i don't live in france or ireland...so i wouldn't know. But If I did I'm sure I would help you out

Madcow: WikiPedia.

Karatedo is one of the 5 original martial arts, kung-fu was created in the XIX century, methinks and it's far less powerful than original karate, so the fact that it evolved from karate that was created in the VII century is just plain silly bullcrap! So please.. Kick that chineese bastard in the nuts once for me, Macow.

kick that chineese bastard in the nuts once for me, Macow.

Lol!

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Well, I believe in you because I know that you're in this karate thing yourself.
Wikipedia is wierd.

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Thats why I put this in my post too.

Sorry, saco, didn't see that.
I apologize.

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@J.C.: This is an intreresting subject for some, but maybe not for you.
Accept that.
If a thread should remain is for a moderator to decide, not you.
You don't know that there is no real answere for this.
If you're not interested, leave this thread, you will only make the forum slower by posting dumb comments about my questions.
Next time you want to complain about my threads, PM me.

kung-fu was created in the XIX century

We never use Roman numerals in English for centuries. Do you in Lithuanian?

XIX = 19, right? :S

Yes.

We never use Roman numerals in English for centuries

not entirely true.. we still use I, II, III quite a lot.. although the Vs and the Xs all went buh-bai

I've never seen "IV century".

numerals were replaced when the roman empire fell down, and left Britain. Was still used for a long time afterwards but then stopped, i dunno when, probably the 1700's or something.

Quickly now! To the wiki-mobile!

catchy tune follows

We use roman numerals to mark page numbers in a book before the actual book starts, mostly in textbooks, like when they are listing authors and contents.

Yeah. That and copyright dates.

We use roman nubers to mark centuries, some other stuff..

And I'm not 100% sure, if kung-fu was created in the 19 th century
Just my guess, coz it's really a new-ish style.

[history lesson/]
Karate on the other hand was created in the 6 th - 7th century by japaneese locals for protection, who weren't allowed to use any weaons by the current emperor. @ first it was only a way of self-defence, although later it evolved to a martial art.
Karate means 'empty hand' and do means 'path', so karatedo means 'the path of the empty hand', as in: omgimgunnatelefragj00withoutanyweaponzjustwithmybarehandunub!!
The main thing in karate is to frag/gib/kill your opponent by 1 single, powerful hit. And to master it - it takes a real shitload of time.

And please, don't give me any of that 'OMFGDIZKARATEIZFAEK' bullshit, or i'm gunna jump ya wit ma' bare hand! Karate-style, sucka!