Certain types of maps should be banned Created 20 years ago2004-11-23 22:54:30 UTC by satchmo

I can already see it happening: noobs everywhere would throw together a "junk yard" type of map, with no architecture whatsoever and models of various junked vehicles stacked to the ceiling. Some of them badly positioned so that the player can get trapped easily.

Secondly, another type of "racing" map would simulate those typical racing game (like some NASCAR game). This would completely defeat the purpose and spirit of the FPS game that Half-Life is.

These types of maps (and many other ones that completely lack any imagination) should be strongly discouraged and perhaps banned from the vault.

Any opinion on this proposal?

I think it takes all kinds... Where would CounterStrike be, if not for being made of maps I, personally, hate?

A person learns through doing and making mistakes. A person also needs to display his "masterpiece", where others can see it. If it's bad, the person will be told. If it's good, the person will be told. A person needs all that input for his mental well-being. He needs to know, good or bad, so as to defend or boast his map. Why map if you just delete it when you're done?

I do think a committee should be appointed to move maps from the problem/ unfinished section to the Completed section, but I don't think anyone should be discouraged from posting legitimate maps.

You've got a very good point, [VDC] Rad Brad. I am not for censorship.

But I also get annoyed when people boast their maps when they've put in absolutely no thought or imagination into it. Why invest in the creative process when one's too lazy to put in the time and effort to make it worthwhile?

And I am very grateful to have this forum and community to discuss all about mapping. But perhaps certain guidelines should be laid out so it's clear what's "imaginative" and "creative", even before mistakes are made?

Hmm, perhaps it's a good idea to write a tutorial on what comprises of a high quality SP and MP map. That way, we don't have a torrent of maps that are fully lit or have monsters that are half stuck in brushes.

But then again, most noobs don't even read the tutorials anyways. So I am not sure how much good that'll do.

I don't like maps that aren't de_, cs_, es or as_, I mean real CS maps, understand fy, aim, ka and all those stupid names noobs give to their noobs maps for noobs games. but beyond that, I really don't like people who call a crappy 2 hours job a "map", especially when they decide by themselves the map is "fun" or "nice" or anything else without any test nor considerations to what the users of the map think. beyond that again, I hate when those people only notice on the map I am working on for four monthes the little mistake in the corner I mentioned many times the map is still under construction and that is just a temporary layout : it's awful how less people are skilled and more they are demanding ...

but that's ok, there are noobs in the gaming community, there are necessarily noobs in the mapping one, the whole internet community is totally infested by noobs in my opinion : people who cannot work on anything and just want instant result as they were in a fastfood : abusers, cheaters, lamers ...

perhaps it's a good idea to write a tutorial on what comprises of a high quality SP and MP map

You'd be lucky

If they can't even think, what makes you think they can read?

Because they sure can write lots of stuff and bad-mouth other people's high quality maps.

But then again, there might be extraordinary circumstances in their personal lives that made them mentally unbalanced. Their fathers could've deserted them when they're young, so they crave love and attention from all the wrong places?

Actually, the above statement is quite harsh. I might have crossed the line on that one.

Thanks, P.

I had problem registering with SnarkPit yesterday. I couldn't join them as a new member. I just kept getting an error message, over and over.

I'll try again today. Maybe I'll get lucky.

I get annoyed when N00bs upload map after map, and they are virtually identical.

ie: a room with a scientist and a crowbar, mission: kill him.
then the same talentless mapper uploads part 2 of the same crap, this time with a few more scientists.

stuff like that should banned, Period.

<Long Post>

I work in construction making anything and everything out of any kind of metal... custom. If you ever see that show, American Chopper, that's what I do, except not to motorcycles... not very often, anyway. So I know how to build things, whatever they may be. The concepts are all the same.

I've been doing it for 20 years, almost... And I have apprentices that I teach for the last 10 or 12 years now. (It's a five year apprenticeship) I know how people learn to build things. Over the years, it happens the same way with each person. And I see it here, in the exact same way, except with computer graphical building blocks instead of metal. Here's how it seems to go:

1st year: Very young, doesn't really understand what's happening, is eager and willing. Uses all his tools wrong (i.e. hammers with clamps instead of hammers, thus destroying clamps). Has to be told how and when to wipe his nose. Tries to do everything at the speed of light, but does it all wrong and has to go back and re-do it all, costing more than doing it right the first time. Not worthy of "thinking" jobs. But he is learning, though he resents it.

2nd year: Tad bit older. Understands there are methods to construction and following them is what other people do, because he KNOWS a better way. He has learned how to wipe his nose without being told. Can do a repetitive task without much monitoring. At this point, he is worthy of being given a very small job to figure out... and bring it back before doing anything to it, written out on paper, for a journeyman to doublecheck and correct, showing him his errors and having him re-do it. He sees that his past errors possibly show him how to proceed. He still doesn't think he is learning much or learning anything at all.

3rd year: Knows he is "da bomb". He's done a few small projects on his own and, now, knows everything. They are not well built, though he thinks they are. He can even wipe his nose on a handkerchief instead of his sleeve and he's proud of it. He can state his problem in a knowledgeable manner and possibly understand the answer (not because he is stupid, but because the answer is still over his head). He has learned that in some special cases, the speed of light is too fast to see the pitfalls. He knows he doesn't know what will screw him up, so he asks questions. He still judges the answer against what he knows, but sometimes disregards the answer. Makes stupid errors that he "knows better", but he is learning other things and not taking the time to check himself. He is worthy of a small, single person project that may take him a few days to complete. Still whines, though he knows he's learning.

4th year: Has actually accomplished (for him) some difficult tasks competently. Will listen to input. More importantly, 1st year people are looking to him to provide answers. They may be wrong or right, but he is now seen as "in the know" by those "not in the know" and it boosts morale big time. He gives the answers freely, but without the requirement of paper. He is being a "friend to all". He starts to understand that paying attention to detail in the "now" is faster than remaking it, in the end. Has learned to blow snot from his nose, thus saving the hankie! Can be trusted to do what is set out for him.

5th year: Provides knowledgeable input on large projects. Has a wide range of skills and a small pool of experience to pull from. Asks questions, even if he knows the answer, because he knows he may not know the answer. Makes 1st years bring problems on paper, so they don't wast his time over and over. Prepares his projects ahead of time for fast construction. Can keep the snot off his boots.

New mapmakers are fast, demand answers, make crap and display it. They are learning to upload just as much as they are learning mapping. After a map or two (that are different), they start to look for answers on their own, so they don't look like fools. After more experience, they begin to ask questions AND understand the answers. They've used the block tool so much they don't even think about it. Unfortunately, at this stage, they start to slam the no0bs, thinking that they are demonstrating their knowledge. They look like fools, though. After their slams are set straight by "those that know", they back off, build mid-quality maps, try new methods, and start "pre-fabbing" before jumping in. At the end, when they are very decent mappers, they've gathered their textures, sounds, and sprites. They've drawn it out on paper, pre-fabbed some of the "machinery", and pulled intricate objects from unused maps to be ready to go!

The point to all that is that if you don't correct the noobs, swat down the "slammers", or let them post material, you won't get a decent mapper.

<whew!>

Great Post!!!

If it is as you write Rad Brad, Then why do they post the same crap over and over again, even after being informed that it's crap?

Why not move on?
Perhaps read a few of the tutorials.

When i started with Hammer 3 years ago, i didn't release crappy maps whose sole purpose is something like kill 5 headcrabs with only one clip of ammo. i kept those to myself, knowing that no one would appreciate them. To me, they were for learning.

i just can't understand why they see the need to release EVERYTHING they make. They should think a bit before they upload: "Will people actually enjoy this or am i wasting both time and bandwidth?"

this point could be discussed : who is the real responsible, the kid who is proud to "release" his first "map", or the hoster to enable him to upload and display his 2 hours job ?

I overall agree with you, but I think there should be a world for everyone : a noobs place for noobs, and places for the other levels of use of Hammer, what I don't like actually, is that nubs are infesting lists of what could be good stuff, see for example CSbanana with the flash movies ... on an other hand, it is still good I think, from a psychological point of view, to see your job displayed somewhere people can check and comment it, that may make you try to do better, to improve your skills and so on : an artist need feedback from his public ...

on other point we may discuss, is that I call "the copy/paste compilation" : a "map" where the noob just copy/pasted every materials he picked around him he like : models, prefabs, textures, even the map concept ... when I see those guys posting on forums "it's my map", sometimes with mentionning the real authors, sometimes with forgetting them ... I really think this behavior is the worst of the community.

[VDC] Rad Brad's long post

1?) discovery : the guy is just realizing the stuff,
2?) methods : the guy realize there are ways to do the job, that to want is not enough, to think first is essential, to try to gather together ideas and do-ability, to plan.
3?) revelation : the guy realize he like what he is doing, that his life is better while creating this way, he is reaching the best of himself.
4?) reference : the guy realize throughout his works he reached a social level in his community, some people are looking at him, are asking him questions ... his skills are beyond him : he can now work with other guys like him, on higher projects ...
5?) profession : the guy realize he could make his life with this passion, he got skills, a public, his art is about to be his social existence.

these are just the artist levels of consciousness in my opinion.

sorry for my english.

The time frame is different for everyone. I have apprentices that I treat as if they are journeymen, because that is the level they have achieved. On the other hand, I work along side journeymen I won't allow onto many of my projects because they don't have the skills required to do the job, even after five, ten, or twenty years. It's not like "today is Thursday, and I released a map, Friday I know now that it's crap, Saturday I release a decent map...." They may release crappy maps for a few months before realizing the fruits of their labor are not being "purchased" by the mapping community. If they are trying to "sell" a map, and it ain't sellin', they will have to improve the quality... or move on to something else.

These things take time.

3?) revelation : the guy realize he like what he is doing, that his life is better while creating this way, he is reaching the best of himself.

This is so spot on! One day, an apprentice will decide for himself that it's a career and not a stepping stone to another job. It's like night and day. All of a sudden, he's paying attention to details we all thought he'd never understand.

SariBous,
I think that they do move on... most of them. After a month or two, at the most. They can't help but improve, if they stay around. I haven't seen one case of those people "posting the same crap map under a different name" not be under 15 or 16 years old. It's just not in a teenager's blood to understand. He may follow the ascribed pattern, yes, but he doesn't know it. They are self centered, not in a bad way, but because it's that stage of life. It happens to everyone. They have probably not even come back to read the comments of the first six maps they posted yesterday. You have to wait until they are "worldly" in the real world before they will apply that to the online world... unfortunately. <---Just my observations.

It's just not in a teenager's blood to understand.

Well excuse me, I never ever spammed the 'Vault with crap maps (I've only posted, I think, two 'Completed Maps', my compo winners) and I've been here since I was about fifteen. Kindly don't excessively stereotype

Perhaps 'twelve or thirteen' would be more realistic. I think so.

The discussion becomes philosophical, and in a good way. I never thought the thread I started would bring out all these great ideas from people. But it's a good demonstration that TWHL can still churn out high-quality and mature discussion on interesting topics.

I believe the various stages of the training process is similar in all trades of life. I am in the medical profession, and I could just as easily apply the description of each stage to years during residency. The interns are always so eager, but half the times, they don't even know what's going on. And when shits hit the fan in the hospital, they just stand to the side, scared shitless.

Anyways, I am glad of the out-pouring of ideas. But I gotta go to see more patients now.

Pfft, when I joined I was 13 and I haven't posted one single crap map - atleast not in completed... maybe fy_pistolice, but common, that map really pwned.

Yeah, age definitely has something to do with it. But there are many who would prove the generalization wrong. Many people (and mappers) are wise way beyond their years.

And I think as a thirty-something, I've earned enough maturity over the years. However, I do see plenty thirty-year-olds doing immature stupid stuff still.

Age doesn't define everything. Maturity varies based on individuals.

And, besides, Seventh-Monkey is just one of a kind!

grins what about Zombie eh?

I have apprentices that I treat as if they are journeymen, because that is the level they have achieved. On the other hand, I work along side journeymen I won't allow onto many of my projects because they don't have the skills required to do the job, even after five, ten, or twenty years.

I agree with you that age is not a definite measure of things.

And Seventh, I wasn't generalizing teenagers in that way. I don't think most teenagers understand, not because of their teen age specifically. Because they are teenagers, they've never been through it, on their own, as individuals questing knowledge. "It" being the "process of learning"... not spamming the vault or posting demands or slamming someone's work. (And public, spoon-fed education isn't learning, to me) I didn't convey that well. And if at 13, they go through it, they will be wise enough at 15 to at least be an active participant in that process of learning. But everyone goes through it at a different time in their life, but (hopefully) it's before they are no longer a teenager.

Okay, I'm a teenager in body but not in mind.

Kindly don't excessively stereotype

Seventh, I think you would probably agree, that mappers such as yourself are the exception, not the rule. Most new mappers--myself included--behave exactly as 'Brad described them when starting out. Not necessarily spamming the vault, so much as continually asking the same bad questions, which they could easily find through the tutorial section or a google.

"It's just not in a teenager's blood to understand."

I'm 17. And i've been mapping since i was somewhere between 13 and 14. And i sure as hell didn't release super-mega-crap maps, even then.

These types of maps (and many other ones that completely lack any imagination) should be strongly discouraged and perhaps banned from the vault.

Any opinion on this proposal?

Nice one asshole. Ever heard of freedom of speech. I wouldn't be talking if I were you either. Your maps aren't exactly made of gold and served to us on a silver platter. Also who the hell made you the all mighty judge of maps? What one person might think is a good design another might think is crap. Beh people like you think after you've made 3 maps your are all of a sudden an expert and have some kind of mighty power over all noobs. Go play with some legos you hypocrite.

See? It's happening as we speak, in the above post! Ah... the "Cycle of Mapping"....

I would never dared to claim that I am an expert, but I am just recommending that people should put in more thought into the design process before they post the final result.

My maps are by no means great. They're always fun to play, but they're not much to look at compared to some of the master mapper's works. In fact, some of them are just down right ugly.

However, the gameplay is always well thought out. I usually play them at least twenty times and fine-tune them carefully before I release them in the vault. I usually draw a schematic diagram on paper before I even load up Hammer to make sure that the idea would be a good one.

I am not for censorship either (you can read my previous post), but I do encourage more thoughtful design. I bet those people who released overly simplistic maps didn't put a lot of thought or planning during the design process.

This doesn't just apply to mapping, but even in other aspects of life. It says a lot about a person who is a careful thinker and planner, and puts a lot of time and energy into a project. I am sure most people would agree to what I say. You can clearly see these characteristics in those master mappers whose works would be deemed masterpieces by almost anyone.

I agree with satchmo, although [VDC] Rad Brad has a point. However, a mapper really starts to get good towards the end of their second year/beginning of third year. Or maybe I'm just self-obsessed

Everyone once started off as a noob and I get tired of seeing box maps but at the same time I hate it even more to see people who think they have the right to decide who's map stays and who's goes. I have been mapping for nine months and have made about 7 maps. I can honestly say that I am an expert at mapping now and thanks to the help of people on other forums I improved my skills. I never tried spamming anything with a pic of everymap I made whether it was good or not. I think you should just make it clear that noobs should not post maps that are simply boxes but wait for their skills to improve and then release something that is good. It's better to spend months making an awesome map than to release a box every week.

I am glad that you understand what I was trying to say in the first place, Spartan 34.

I am all for freedom of speech and I would vehemently oppose any sort of limitation in that regard. But I also want to lift the standard of everyone's maps and prevent any embarassment by n00bs when they post these box maps. Most people realize the beginner quality of their maps without having others telling them so, but some out there appear to be less clued in to that.

It'll just help them to heed some advice, so six or seven months later, they wouldn't look back to the days and regret that they ever uploaded those maps in the first place.

I just started mapping in September (two months ago), so obviously I am still very new at it and got lots to learn.

Man, this has gotta be the best-written thread I've ever seen on TWHL. Many many thanks to you all for spending time writing your posts properly!

Satchmo I can honestly say I agree with you when you express your mood towards box maps. I get tired of seeing 5 box maps in a row and then one that might be of good quality. What pissed me off was that you presented yourself almost as if you didn't want noobs to post anything at all. I think that It should be made clear that if they post a box map then their map will be severly ridiculed. I did a flame comment on one of the most recent box maps because of the reason that I have already stated. There are many very good mappers on this site who spend the time to create unique and well designed maps. I applaud those people.

It's better to spend months making an awesome map than to release a box every week.

I agree, but it's not totally true : a long development project got much more chances to fail than a 15 days one, because of the compilators limits or lack of organisation for example : a good mapper in my opinion has to find the right point between speed and work, a 15 years ultimate roxing map wouldn't be that great, if it's released when everybody forgot the game. at last, there is the problem of fashions too : sometimes people massively play de_dust2 style maps, sometimes they are looking for mindless fy_iceworld style ones ...

Yeah, that was never my intent. Noobs need to post their maps so they can learn from the input of those who are more experienced. It's the best way to learn how to map and design levels. That's how I learned in the past two months, and I don't think there is any other way to replace this valuable learning method.

But what's equally important is to download other well-designed maps and walk around in them, learning from the finished products of those maps. Isn't it embarassing to post box maps when you see others are making these incredibly beautiful cities using the same tools and engines?

Elevate the quality of your maps, and you'll elevate yourself.

I am working on that project by the way :

http://www.ideaseed.net/maps/CS16/screenshots.html

almost 4 work monthes until now (at least 4 hours a day, no week-end), and maybe 2 or 3 more ones to complete it : I think this project could be the most time-expending one for CS1.6 (everything 100% original), but sometimes I fear we (we are 3 guys working on it) won't ever be able to complete it because of the software limits ...

is that what you call an awesome map ? right now we have no clue about the awesomeness of the map, because as it isn't completed enough to be tested, it is still possible we will just release a nice looking, but crappy map from a gameplay point of view, because of some details we didn't think the whole project, and wasted half a year on ...

a great advantage of releasing a quickly done map, is that when the concept is good, confirmed, you can still improve it later, with some guarantees your time will be rewarded ...

Lol, I sure no one is going to work on a map for 15 years. As for J.C. I'd like to know why it is taking you so long to make a map with 3 people? Even with all new original material that is quite a long work process. I could only think that NS maps might take that long.

P.S. If there were more people like you guys on TWHL I might visit these forums more often and have some nice things to say.

wow thanks , but I am not that often here ...

it is taking me so long because I am looking for perfection (I don't want to release a map everybody will say about it "hey nice map", then forget it and let the map die in the middle of hundreds of others on some web databases ...), and because I am unexperienced with Hammer (and HL and the compilators) then most things I do is first an error, then not bad (at least doesn't make the compilation fail), then finally fine after hours of tests (after revised lightings, shadows, collisions and all those stuff that make the life of a level designer so exciting ...)

somebody said (Jimmy Hendrix, but I am not sure) :
"why to play so much (music) notes while it just needs to play the best ?" (sorry for my english, I hope that means something ...)

that philosophy can be applied for everything in life, and actually I am appling it in this project : while I wouldn't like to release middle quality 5-10 maps everybody will say "hey nice map" but nobody will play, I am doing my best on one single shot, then plan to switch on an other editor ...

So, J.C., in your experience with other types of map editors, how does Hammer compare?

I've only mapped using Hammer, so I have no idea where it stands. But from what I read about in these forum, it's a highly regarded editor (even compared to UnrealEd).

I tried running SandBox (for FarCry), but it takes too much resources that my hardwares can barely handle it.

No joke. I have some of my maps at Snarkpit if you want to see them. Not all of them are finished though. I am working on a DoD map right now and have 50% of the map done in just 3 days. I'll show some pics tonight when I do a compile.

I'm no KFS yet but I'm not a noob either. I haven't worked on any mods. An expert mapper I think is someone who has mastered 95% of all the entities. Completed some maps. Almost never runs into leaks or other noob errors. Can complete on average a map every two months. Doesn't make box maps. I know I;m not the best mapper but I can say I am a very good mapper and know I'm not just bullshitting. I work to become a better map though and I hope that eventually my maps will become very well known. The only map I have on this site is dpb_bootcamp which was just a one day experiment to create a paintball field dressed up like a basic training camp for grunts.

So, J.C., in your experience with other types of map editors, how does Hammer compare?

well, my only real experience except Hammer is the Aliens versus Predator 2 lithtech editor I used (tried to at least) 2 years ago ...
(I used too the starcraft and warcraft 2 and 3 map editor, but it's off-topic I think, you can check the maps I did here ==> http://www.ideaseed.net/web/TRM/download/maps.htm )
Hammer itself is fine (I am using it for 6 monthes) : the lego system (the name I give to the grid+block system) is fine once you got it, the shift+tool interface is stupid (because the control key is just under) but you quickly get the hand, but what I really hate with Hammer is ... the compilators : the compilators are real pure crap in my opinion : I think those damn bastards take so much time to compile not because they are compiling the map, but because they are looking to any way (I mean ANY) to find some excuse to not complete the job, like fucking lazy assholes : I mean, come on, my map project is ambitious and we hit most software limits of the compilators, sometimes we got errors "wtf ? what's the problem ? you stopped the compilation because of ... that ?" (can't remember specifically, just it was ridiculous). the "lets play a game : find me" leaks, the "omg too much work MAX_MAP_PATCHES_EXCEEDED error, and some others I don't even want to remember. I never succeeded to complete a compilation with the original Hammer compilators, and I succeded for the first time to complete a compilation with the ZHLT ones (without use the wonderful presets I mean) yesterday, after 6 monthes of experience ! ALWAYS SOMETHING WRONG !

gg compilators : no re tks bye.

well, the monolith AvP2 level editor was overall better than Hammer : more powerful, was compiling even with hundreds of errors (it was just writing a novel of lines of errors and took DAYS), and beyond that, I was able to directly import my 3DS brushes as map elements. the only thing wrong with that editor, was that the game was really sucking (quakish multiplayer levels, crappiest ever gameplay, an awful noobs attracting game (because of the predator cloak+autoaiming weapons), without talking about the lag (I never played with a ping less 200 ...).

I tried SandBox ... 5 minutes : when I seen the interface and the tools, I ran away as fast as I was able too.

but I will retry, someday ...

But, Spartan 34, your DOD map on SnarkPit doesn't have any screenshot, so it's hard for people to appreciate your skills. The Bootcamp map at TWHL doesn't help to showcase your work either.

I think, before you make any claims, you have to be ready to back them up with maps that rock. Otherwise, people might be tempted to call your bluff.

Personally, I think it's very feasible to become good at mapping in nine months. It's a matter of how much time someone puts into mapping. Three to four hours a day, seven days a week would make nine months a long time for any learning process.

Who are you, Anonymous? I bet everyone wants to know your true identity. Why not sign-in when you post?

The DoD map you looked at Satchmo is not the one I'm working on right now. I also clearly stated that not all of my maps are at The Snarkpit. I should have a bsp of my current DoD by tonight and then I'll post some pics of what I've finished in 3 days.

Man, this has gotta be the best-written thread I've ever seen on TWHL. Many many thanks to you all for spending time writing your posts properly!

Punctation and grammar always improve when you're trying to make a point!

The others I have not posted because they are either not compiled yet or have not gotten around to playing them and taking screenshots.

Good is relative. Compared to some of the crap maps and noob cubes in this vault, I'd say your maps look very good. Compared to Half-life2, Doom3, Nightwatch, and a whole lot of other maps both professionaly made and made by hobbyists, I'd say your maps look very bad.

Ok buddy. I'd sure as hell love to see some pics of your maps. Also how in god's name can you even compare my maps to the noob cubes. Obviously HL2 and Doom 3 maps will look better than mine becuase I have to make my maps on an older engine and due to the limitations I also have to be careful about how I make my maps. I'm not a proffesional either. I'd say that in the short time I've been mapping I've accomplished a lot. I enjoy all my maps and treat them like a peice of art work. I like to give them a certain atmosphereric feeling that obviously you could never understand.

because :

[_] he doesn't want we know who he is
[_] he doesn't have so much time to waste to log
[_] he doesn't know how to register
[_] he forgot his password
[_] he don't know what nick to pick
[_] he doesn't find anymore that nice picture he love to have as avatar
[_] he like that "anonymous" nick
[_] everywhere on the net he goes, he like to play with identities and anonymous status, he feel like a secret agent
[_] everywhere on the net he goes, he have fun being an asshole to not have to assume what he just layed stinking in the middle of the room
[_] he doesn't himself who he is
[_] he is about to tell you who he is, preparing us a big surprise
[_] you are that guy, but as you are schyzophrenic, you don't know that, and are indeed talking with an other side of yourself ...
[_] you are that guy, and have fun posting with the anonymous status to tell some things you want without have to waste your reputation here
[_] he is posting with only one hand, using the other to ####### watching for porn stuff
[_] TWHL unlog him everytime he post
[_] he cannot tell you who he is, else he could have to kill you
[_] his nick is inside every of his post, and he want us to look for it
[_] indeed, that's not a guy who posted, but a dog that jumped on the keyboard, and writed that post at pure random
[_] that guy is trying to tell you he is loving you, but you don't want to understand
[_] he is a guy from a secret scientific company, testing you, for some psychological experience ...
[_] you are talking to a bot, but the logging feature hadn't been coded yet

oh,
I answered to

Who are you, Anonymous? I bet everyone wants to know your true identity. Why not sign-in when you post?

I didn't see there was an other page : ...

Spartan 34: When did he say his maps were better than yours? Personally, I just don't like people who boast their maps. At all.

LOl. Nice theories J.C. I'm sure one of those has to be correct.