How do i start Created 16 years ago2007-08-26 17:17:35 UTC by Bluenote

A friend and i had a question, we're shooting around ideas on a new map we'd like to build, it's our first go at it. The idea is that it's based in outdoors, i'll start there...now do you build a large "room" and then fill it up or can you just start by layin down your terrain and then build the noclip/skybox around the completed environment?

source sucks for outdoor environments. you might want to rethink your idea.

Penguinboy,

What idea do you have in mind for outdoor environments for a Mod like DoD?

It's not about creating a open space (performance and gameplay will suck), it's about creating the illusion of one.

Dave is right. The Source engine is terrible at rendering large open areas because of its incredibly outdated rendering techniques. As such, anytime you enter any area with empty space, your FPS will take a hit (if you've got a high-end machine, you'll need to look closely to spot it, or turn on the FPS counter and see for yourself).

Now, when designing an "outdoor" environment, a mapper (well, the good ones) will try and minimise the amount of empty space in an outdoor area. Usually they'll do this by not making large outdoor areas, surrounding the area in buildings or something similar, and good mapping techniques. For example, surrounding the entire map in a giant box is not going to get you anywhere. However, simply putting the sky texture on a single brush to 'cap' an area will work quite well. Think of a cup for a moment: the bottom of the cup represents the ground, the walls of the cup represent the surroundings, and the top of the cup is obviously the sky. Now, encasing the entire cup in a box just to block off the hole is inefficient. Putting a cap just on the top of that cup is much better.

Hope that helps.

Oh, i completely understand that. That is a skybox correct? I have read/watched a few tuts on the subject and understand that's what i have to do. I think what i need to ask is: when building an the "cup" as you say Ant, can i lay down the terrain for the bottom of the "cup" the cliffs for the "sides" of the cup, fill the cup with "matter". When that is all done cap it with a skybox high enough to make it look like the sky texture is actually a sky. As opposed to this: Creating a huge "cup with a cap" first then building up the sides and then filling with matter.

Or did i just answer my question myself... or will either way work. Did both of those above statements have the same meaning, developing the same outcome just approaching it differently..?

I think I know what you're asking, but correct me if I'm wrong: Are you asking if you need to seal the map before it's complete? If so, then no, you don't HAVE to seal the map, but it's good practice to. When the map is open to the void, you get what's called a 'leak' (pretty apt name, eh? ). The void itself doesn't get refreshed, so you get that ugly HOM effect. Not only that, but VIS, the program that splits the map into pieces so it doesn't render the whole mess at the same time (which save CPU resources), doesn't run, which is bad. Leaks can be hard to find, so it's a good idea to hunt them down when you see them, so they don't create problems later.

If it helps you design the map's geometry, you can leave the top off in Hammer to get a nice sky view, then quickly cap the 'cup' and compile, so you don't get the leak. Just always always always make sure that the final version is leak-free so that peoples' PCs don't melt when they try to run your map

Yeah, you don't need to create the cup as such from the get go. So long as your map is sealed when you want to compile it. However, as RS said, it's good practice to do so: trying to seal your map properly after you've filled it full of crap tends to get confusing and frustrating as all these little leaks start appearing.

By the way, research the cordon tool. It effectively puts a virtual box around whatever section of the map you want. Anything in that box will be compiled and anything outside it will not. It's essentially a giant skybox, so it's good for testing small areas.

Ant and RS those are the answers im looking for. Thanks for the inside look. Like i have said im new to this but im really engaged when i have the time. I might just play a bit of DoD for about a half an hour now and then go practice mapping for those other couple hours that i would have been playin. Hammer is quite a tool. I have everything drawn on the ol' paper but getting it into hammer with all of what i had in mind will take some time obviously, but i had to start somewhere.

Thanks again. I will stay in touch

Ant: Creator of 'The BSP Cup Theory'.

And to think, all this time i've been looking at my maps as giant dinner plates.

ahh, strider...it depends on how you look at it. Your giant dinner plate could be a really flat cup.

Hah. =P

my maps are more like... colanders.
Based upon the cup theory but too many leaks to sort through