Comp From scratch: Motherboard Created 16 years ago2008-09-25 11:56:58 UTC by Tetsu0

Hey fellas. I've been saving up for a new rig for a month or so. (Been putting aside $50+ a week) So i wanna start with a kickass motherboard. One i can upgrade for a while, and has preferable an intel processor. A real fast dual core, or a quad core, or idk.
I really don't know what to look for and everything seems damn confusing.
I have a case all picked out. I comes with a 550w power supply and it has a huge fan on the case so airflow shouldn't be a problem at all.
This is my case i'm looking at buying: From Geeks.com
And as for motherboards, some come with Processors, some come without them and i do not have a clue as to what to buy or look for really.

I definitly want dual or quad core capability.
I don't know if DDR3 is better than DDR2 (my guess says yes but is the difference really drastic?)
I THINK i want a PCI-E input for my videocard.
I say i think because i don't know.

Anyone have any suggestions as to what would be a good base motherboard for me?

Asus Striker II - ?235 - Ludicrously well endowed, but expensive with it.

For a decent price, the best mobo you can get is the
MSI P45 Neo-F - ?76 - a bargain for what you get.

As for processor, you want
Core 2 Quad Q6600 - ?119 - Huge overclocking potential.

Ok well since i posted i went and did some research.
I got up Nvidia's site and they had a card - processor efficiency thing comparison chart. So i know what processor and which graphics card i want. from that i found some other parts. let me know what you think.

Processor:
Intel Core 2 Duo E4600 --- $120 USD
Graphics Card:
GeForce 9600GT (ASUS) --- $120 USD
Case:
10 Bay ATX case w/ Fan and 550W power supply --- $40 USD
Motherboard:
ASRock P43 Twins1600 --- $70 USD
Hard Disk:
Western Digital 160GB 7200RPM SATA @ 3.0Gb/s --- $50 USD
RAM:
2.0Gb DDR2 OCZ Fatal1ty Edition --- $80 USD

All in all the total comes to $480 USD which is actually $20 under budget.
And i think it'll be a powerhouse for how much it costs.

I'll Be running XP until i can afford Vista.
And i'll Buy things one at a time when i can afford them.
First things first i'll get the case, then motherboard, ram, and the processor. I'll take my old GFXcard and HD and use those until i get the new equipment. Would this be a good or bad idea?

What do y'all think?

If you map ---------> Buy Quad Core Q6600

Compiling uses 4 cores and compiling times are ridicously short.

wtf 160 GB HDD??? I used 160 GB the first week of my new HDD! Buy a 750 GB or 500 GB which costs 80 ? aprox!!! And forget about files size!

I would get a better graphics card too... 8800 GT is better than 9600.

And belive me about the processor, get a quad for the same price and overclock it, you will get a 800 ? processor for 130 ?.

One i can upgrade for a while

http://www.nvidia.com/object/balancedpc.html
Hit launch configurator. Check out the processor to card specs.
That's what i'm basing my purchases on.
I'm not forking out a ridiculous amount of money for a computer.
For my budget; $500 USD, i think this is a good computer.
And this is not just a primary mapping computer i don't need the quad core. Most applications don't even support quad core. My motherboard does, however, and in the future, if i want another processor, i can just buy a quad and swap it out.
Plus this has DDR3 ram support so when that becomes cheaper, i can just use that as well.
/end defence

p.s. i fried a processor overclocking.
I did it wrong and i'm afraid i'll do it wrong again. So noty.

I never overclock anything. The risk outweighs the advantage, which is so small that it doesn't even matter anyway. One thing I recommend is that you get a much bigger hard drive. Look at all the gigs/cost ratios and find the best one. Here 500GB drives are the best value, but it might be different over there.

Also, don't bother with DDR3. Price outweighs performance. I say stick with XP too. You may also want to consider getting a better video card, but I understand if you want to stick with the 9600 for the price.

One more thing - don't use the default power supply. for the price it is, I doubt it's a quality brand, and the PSU is the most important part of your system. I got a cheap PSU once, and it almost fried my whole computer. Luckily I got it out before it started shorting, because I could feel the heat of it on my leg (through the case, and through the air. It was fucking hot.)

I'm going with DDR2 ATM. And you're right, i should probably spend the extra $30 for a bigger HD.
and.. hat wattage/brand would you recommend for the power-supply penguinboy?
I'm just getting a half-way decent computer. I don't need anything like.. top of the line. Just a budget computer that's GOOD, and can run Ep2 games without making my computer blow up.

I totally agree about getting the better hdd... 160GB is too too small and HDDs are ridiculously cheap.

I would get a better gfx card too, but you could do a lot worse than the 9600 fo sho. Check out a video card benchmarking list and weigh the price differences to the performance superiority of other cards, and maybe you might consider increasing the budget? ; )

Anyway a nice, upgradable comp for cheap = win. = )

There is always going to be room for improvement. This computer as it stands right now, will be probably twice as good, if not better, than my current setup. So... i'll take that.

You're advised, you will fill that HDD on a month.

My Steam account weights 26 GB with no MODS, and just Source games...

Antec Midi Tower Three Hundred No PSU
Apacer Card Reader APAE1011-S 16-in-1 Intern 3,5" USB2.0
Asus DVD-/+/RAM DRW-2014S1T 20x/20x/14x DL Retail
Asus DVD-ROM E818AT 18x/48x Bulk (zwart)
Asus P5E64 WS Evolution iX48, SATA2 RAID, GLAN
Asus Graphiccard PCI-e Radeon HD4850 1GB DDR3
Cooler Master Powersupply Realpower 700W
Corsair 2x2GB DDR3 SDRAM PC10666 CL9.0 XMS3
Creative Soundcard X-Fi Xtreme Gamer 7.1 PCI
Intel Core 2 Duo E8500 3.16GHz 1333 6MB Box
Maxtor 1TB SATA300 32MB, STM31000340AS

My new pc, its build to buy a Quad core and a second videocard in the feature. At the moment you dont need a Quad core to play games or do video edditing. Ofcourse, some things goes faster. But the best thing is to wait for like 1/2 years. Then those Quad cores are much cheaper and maby much better. Because Quad cores are still in beta fase. And the released once are still "proto types".

Thanks for the link there penguin. I'll have to check newegg for some powersupplies; which will raise my budget, but i don't care. It's just another week i'll have to deal with my dell.

spike, I've dealt with an 80 gig HD in my dell for the 4 years i've been using it. Plus i have a 300 gig external i have for backup. I think i'll be fine on storage.

Yeah raver. I do plan on getting a quad core in the future. I want my system to be good now, and better later; when i can afford it.

I want to build for the future upgrades.

I just hope my motherboard will last me about 4-5 years.

---

Another question i got for you guys is i keep seeing video cards with DVI-I ports. Am i gonna need a special monitor for that? Or is there an adapter or something..

---

EDIT
Nevermind...

after reviewing better cards, i come to find out Geforce 8800 GTS comes with adapters

Newegg.com, Tigerdirect.com, eBay.com, Amazon.com and a few more online dealers are most of the time the normal places to get brand new computer stuff, sometimes on the cheap. Well, if you really want to go even more cheaper and dont mind older stuff, then I recommend these two websites:

www.pacificgeek.com - Specializing in providing computer-related excess inventory, manufacturer-closeouts, high-demand and hard to find-end of life computer components and peripherals at highly-discounted prices.

www.evertek.com - Evertek is the World?s largest excess Computer Distributor, closeout Computer Wholesaler, clearance Computer Supplier, and closeout Electronics Wholesaler. WARNING: You will need a reseller permit to buy from this website, you can get this from your home state, most of the time for free.

You should get 4 GB of memory. 2 GB is quite small nowadays.

GeForce 8800 is much better than 9600.

BTW, here's my rig:

FYI - Tiger Direct has good deals on memory right now. I just got 4 gigs for about $100 but that is DDR not DDR2. There are still some good deals for DDR2 memory as well. And yes, I will change over when I buy another motherboard I had just bought this one when the stupid memory changed over to DDR2.

ASUS motherboards rules, don't buy the other garbage, it will let you down!

Dunivan

I got my 8 GB of G.Skill DDR2 memory (the PI Black series) for $99 from Newegg.

8 GB is incredibly huge. In fact, I can't think of any program that can use that much memory.

I only have 1.5 GB RAM

And Quad-Cores currently released are prototypes? Are you high? They've been around for about 2 years now. Getting a Quad-Core would be a very good choice.

Definitely get an Asus motherboard, i have an Asus laptop and its a sweet machine. It has NEVER been bogged down, even with massive compiles, i can still do other things like play HL with no lag. You will need more ram. Mine is 3gb and that has room for upgrade. You will want at least 3gb for good performance.

It's just my preference, but you should get at least a 250+ gb HDD and then use a much larger external drive for data storage. If you have high-powered USB ports, some external drives can use two USB ports, one for data transfer and one for power. This greatly improves you system by allowing much more swapspace for programs which gives you better speed. And don't worry about longer USB data transfers. By a good external drive and the transfer rate can be better than your HDD transfer rate. I even have my old WON version of Half-Life installed on my External drive and I have no trouble whatsoever. You also have a very handy backup if you computer decides to kick the bucket (or you decide to upgrade)

These are the memory that I bought. They have low cas latency and they work great.

Yup GeForce 8800 is an awesome card; the 9600 is fail, period.

Tetus0 i would totally go with a bigger hdd, who cares if you go a little over budget. I would even sacrifice the 7200 speed to get a 5400 twice the size. With the size of programs 160 is entirely insufficient imo. (my own computer only came with a 200GB@7200, i've been using it for only a month or so and i'm almost full.) I'm buying a 320GB drive for my rigs spare bay as soon as i get some extra cash and buy some other things i need first.

Satchmo: i would totally go ddr3 with that system, but that's just me. I mean everything else is top of the line, why stop at the memory?

Uhh, we're talking about desktops, right? I've never seen a Desktop HDD with a speed of less than 7200RPM (in the last, say, 5 years?). Putting a 5400RPM drive in a desktop is really stupid, because it'd be a laptop drive -_-

Here's my hard drive setup, I find it works quite well:
200GB: windows and programs, as well as my working directory
200GB: game installs, steam, mapping, etc
700GB: storage
I need more room for storage, but I've never run out of space on my programs or games drives!

also, cap t: buy the best value HDD. here, the cost of 1TB drives is the best value (i.e. cost-per-gigabyte). divide the price by the number of GB and the best value one is the lowest result. (when talking HDD, 1TB = 1000GB, not 1024GB)

Penguinboy, they aren't used much any more, but 5400RPM is/was an extremely common hard drive speed. Don't know what to say.

Anyway, some people are really good space savers, or just not space hogs. Not everybody needs or wants their entire game collection installed at one time, And not everybody torrents stuff as much as I or others do. 160GB is pretty damn small though, especially with game installs now commanding something like 20GB if I'm not mistaken. Something like 320GB would be much more realistic even if you're not undertaking huge downloads.

Oh, and I just checked Newegg. They sell a 320GB for 50 dollars, 8 bucks more and twice the size of that wimpy 160GB you got there. But hey, if you want to throw away your money on overpriced obsolete components, be my guest.

but 5400RPM is/was an extremely common hard drive speed

in the last, say, 5 years

was is the keyword here. I'm talking about new HDDs, obviously.

They were pretty common 2 or 3 years ago. I had the option of buying one when I first built my computer.

But yeah, it looks like you can't even buy them anymore. And I don't know why you would want to.

I've never seen a Desktop HDD with a speed of less than 7200RPM (in the last, say, 5 years?)

Lawl i really didn't know that! I guess it makes sense since the last desktop i built/owned was an amd K6 450MHZ or something like that back in the late '90s. I remember that chipset severely conflicting with my ATI All-in-wonder card and my system would crash all the time till i put a voodoo card in... ah the memories = )

I was rummaging through my storage boxes at my parents' place today, and I found a 386 CPU from the 1990s.

I'll post a picture when I get home.

P.S. Sorry man, it's only remotely related to this topic.

Introducing my very old 386 CPU from 1987.

Here is a related video.

Now that i know im dealing with christmas presents i talked my rents into getting me some better products.
Keep in mind i'm building this to get it up and running, and i'm adding to it as i go along. I do plan on extending my ram to 4 gig, and eventually to DDR3 when it's less expensive.

So i'm getting the 8800 not the 9800, i'm gettin the 2 gig of ram i showed (it's only like $30 now) and my dad's picking me up a 500gig HD.

And about the motherboard, i already have the mobo, cpu, and dvd+rw drive installed.

@ Satch.
Reminds me of my old ZEOS 586

My advise is that you save your money and wait at least one more year. Intel just introduced their brand new processor on the market : Nehalem.

It's and i7 processor, and from my point of view it shocks me with its power just as core2duo did when it was launched. Of course the LGA 775 will quickly become history, it's being replaced by the LGA1366. It's kinda confusing to remember the names, it has 1366 pins but its DRR3 controler reaches 1333 mhz

But the technology that makes this piece of baby so interesting and powerful is called QPI(short for quick path interconnect). I can't remember well, but it like hooking up the ram,video card and proccessor in one unit. No need for FSB anymore.... That means that the cores will communicate quicker and the amount of bandwidth is huge.
It also has around 700 millions of transistors( around 700 because I don't remeber the exact number) and it's lithographed at 45 nm.

There will also be 3 versions : i7 920,940 and 965 Extreme Edition
But even the mainstream (920) will be a lot more powerful than all the processors available today.
The most expensive one is around 1000 USD and the cheapest around 300 USD.
For exact values search on google ,I only told you what I remembered(and I remember quite well actually because it was interesting )

A new line of intel processors has never caused a drop in the older models, it just stopped the distribution of those.

Of course pepper, you see pentium 4 in all the magazines and adds. What can I say ....

You are perfectly right, I still have a pentium 2. The stoppinf of the distribution of that processor never stopped me using that computer.

So yeah, you are so right. Check this lines after two years or three please.

Well guys i got it all running. I ended up going with a BFG TECH NVIDIA GEForce 8800 GTS. The ASROCK P43 motherboard. Got the same processor. I have a 1TB HD that my dad got me, i also have 4gig DDR2 Ram, Corsair. (Even though windows XP thinks it's only 3.18 gig)
I transferred the DVD RW drive from my dell, and i'm upgrading the power supply to a name brand as soon as i have the funds.
Everything went off without a hitch. I had to call microsoft and explain that my old computer doesnt have xp installed anymore in order to re-activate it again on this comp.
After that though, loaded up steam, and portal, and i'm loving the results.

Getting average 130-140 fps just with max settings, and 80-90 with a 2 portals open, and looking into both.

Sweet!

I am playing through HL2 again on my new computer too.

(Even though windows XP thinks it's only 3.18 gig)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_Address_Extension
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/283037 (also applies to WinXP)

..or just get WinXP64 which is basicly just Windows Server 2k3 (which will be supported long after WinXP32 support is discontinued) with the server components removed. You might have problems finding drivers for obscure hardware but otherwise it's fine.

It works better than XP 32, I'm using it right now.
If you want it in any other language than English you must first install XP x64 in English and then install a MUI (language) pack and SP2 MUI update.

Well i'm getting vista as soon as i can afford it so i guess i'm just gonna have to deal.
It's so fast regardless so i really dont care right now.

Vista.. I'd just stick with XP32 or XP64 if I were you. Also, what is there to deal with? Turn on PAE or "buy" XP64. There's very little reason to bother with Vista. With a ridiculously powerful machine and EVERYTHING disabled it edges out XP (while using double the memory, which might not be an issue if you've got loads anyway but it's still sad that it uses double the memory of a full bloat default XP installation despite having everything disabled).

64-bit isn't exactly a huge performance gain for 99% of things you'll end up running, most programs/games you'll be running won't have 64-bit binaries, and the difference in OS performance isn't exactly staggering. Your bet if you really insist on running a 64-bit OS is XP64, and if you understand why it's not as big of a performance gain as some people might lead you to believe or you just have compatibility issues with XP64, you should just stick with XP32 and turn on PAE.

I have Vista 64 now, and after I disabled everything (Superfetch, System Restore, Windows Defender, etc), it runs very fast and smoothly.

And I have not had any compatibility issues with it so far.

I got Vista 64 (Home Premium) on sale (Black Friday) for $69, and it was actually cheaper than XP.

Looks like im waiting til next year