New Mod: "Turnstile" Created 18 years ago2006-01-31 15:05:49 UTC by Rimrook

For starts, here is the dictionary meaning of turnstile

A mechanical device used to control passage from one public area to another, typically consisting of several horizontal arms supported by and radially projecting from a central vertical post and allowing only the passage of individuals on foot.

You often see these outside fancy banks and such. I'm not gonna use them to their exact meaning though, but i've found out some new awsome things as i finished up my dm_poisongarden map. It's so awsome, i'm building a mod based on it.

OUTLINE:
You awake in a strange place. This place is a world of gates and doors that create a labyrinth of passageways. You find out that a strange recepticle had picked you up during a teleportation field test. You must find a way to re-enable the teleporter by gathering arcane items from the area while fighting off enemies, exploring, and solving puzzles. It's a simple concept.

NEW FEATURES:
I would like to utilize the elements of climbing, but not like climb maps, but more of the sort where you can grab a ledge that's above head height and pull yourself up.

Another aspect that would be important is the ability to let the player grow on an experience and level system of some sort. The abilities you could improve with would be your max health, max armor, and overall damage.

overall, these are the only 2 things i really need. I could use a short ladder to climb the ledges and such, but the experience system could get tough. I've seen it done before in mods made by people from twhl, so any help would be awsome.

I will release beta tests since this is a longer project. I'll need testers when the time arrives.

will there be TWHL members working on this project with you?

For wich engine? Source?

/me slaps ZEG very hard over the head with a model turnstile.

Rimrook. Will. Not. Move. To. Inferior. Source. Engine. Mapping

i just picked up the latest version of Spirit of Half Life (HL1) and it's source files. Yeah, i could use some help with this mod, but not so much for mapping tho, sorry. well... maybe a little, but you have to use the textures I make and use the same compile settings. I hope that i don't need to heavily code anything, for i don't know code or any of that. I'm not sure about modelling either.

Well, apparantly you can do the moddelling now, mister Rimrook...

But if there is anything i can help with, just ask..

what happened to your other mod,climbing over the walls and stuff?And the player is gonna be a girl which is an exprement in a secret sector of black mesa?

there aren't any plugins for modelling exporting to HL for 3ds max. Modelling is not an option for me.

If you want to help and can model, you can start by modelling an uber-l33t looking teleporter that twice as big as the player.

EDIT:
2nd-life? That would work better with HL2, given it has physics and the gravgun to model psychic powers off of.

EDIT: THE SEQUEL:
C'mon, i do need some help. I atleast need some input into whether or not you want to map or model or code for this mod.

Let's just say that you'll be able to pull out some of the limits you would normally have. Anyone feeling adventuruous?

oh yeah, it's an adventure mod, so it's not gonna be carnage with monsters, but enough to level and have boss battles and all that.

I'm a bit inspired by all of the doors and rooms that Metroid Prime had, but not so gravity or fancy in that matter.

This sounds really good Rimrook. Although I wouls suggest having an additional thing in the code: Some kind of sword or close combat weapon (Gunblade ;o http://www.rit.edu/~hll1858/imm/media/virtualroom/gunblade-vero.jpg?). More pistols and such. Better / more modern energy weapons and an upgrade system that allows you to find upgrades to make weapons stronger (like clip expanders, damage increasers, ROF enhancers ETC.

Then this mod of yours could be awesome. I really like the whole concept of a more adventure game rather than a "lol shootem up" and the EXP systems sounds great. Good luck with this.

C'mon, i do need some help. I atleast need some input into whether or not you want to map or model or code for this mod.

I can help you with the entity work but I guess,I'll help when you post the problem in TWHL.

have boss battles

I can help with your boss battles,because I've got many of em in my mod.

All that sounds good, but code is not something I can personally do. I was thinking about using a epee for the melee weapon instant of the standard crobar, but i don't have any modlers yet.

EDIT: Awsome, Saco. I'll let you know what we're dealing with when I make an example map for Spirit. If you want to help, i suggest you get Spirit if you don't already have it.

Rimrook, there is a exporter, dont know where it is, but it is somewhere.

I recall there being one in the modeling sdk.

Otherwise, use teh-magical-exporter-trick © - pepper industries ®

Or, in laymens word, do a export to a export to a other program to export from there with a different exporter.

the hlsmd.dle doesn't work with 3ds max 8. sorry, i tried it. I'll need some assistance with this mod, that's a matter of fact.

I could do some mapping, if you need any assistance on that area.

And don?t think that banko_arena has anything to do with my mapping skills, it?s ugly but it was ALL about gameplay

If you use that as base on kalling me a "bad mapper"

Get blender, export from max to .obj, import in blender and then export to hl.

Note: .obj is know as the wavefront format.

Rimrook. Will. Not. Move. To. Inferior. Source. Engine. Mapping

Then why are you moving to Source Hunter?

Well I'm not good with modelling but if you need a texture / skin artist I'm getting into that at the moment.

source IS BETTER THAN 1.6. FACE IT.

mapping with 1.6 is just easier if you dont want to learn about all the new effects. build cubemaps? omgnoway! hide

Well I'm not good with modelling but if you need a texture / skin artist I'm getting into that at the moment.

I think Rimmie has proven on more than one occasion that he is damn good with textures

i still need modellers and skinners. possibly coders. I'm not great with skinning so i wouldn't mind some helpers with that. Coding...pfft. make me an offer.

A link to this blender program would be better than telling me about it.

i should release the zoo map soon so you all can know what kind of mapping we're dealing with.

EDIT: I released the zoo map testing some things. But i think i'll have to wait with this mod until after valentines day. I need to do something special for my girlfriend. Ya know, someone i know outside of HL...

Google is your friend.....

oh wait, i found it. i think. I'll let you know. Thanks again pepper

Whoa! Rim I loved the jumping example map, though the bit where you had to climb allong the beam ledge with just your hands (presumably) was too hard.

Heh, i took advantage of that HL glitch and made it where you have to go slow if you haven't noticed, but yea, it has it's bugs.

EDIT: Now that i think about, i can smooth it out and make it glitch free but functioning. Was any of that climbing stuff too difficult?

Alright, i know blender has a .smd exporter to download somewhere, though hazerdous knows more about this.

I have it, although its in text format and you have to manually copy it into the script window.

its on wikipedia somewhere

The jumping was pretty easy rim, if you took your time (though I did fall a fair few times on that one where you have to go slow at first). If there was rising acid or lava or somthing like that putting pressure on it would be cool. People tend to make more mistakes when they are under time pressure and I bet that map would be a laugh on HLDM, who can climb to the top where the 1 gun in the level is?

I could do some coding.

Ok, chickenfist. Before anything, you think you can rig up an experience and level gain system. I can do almost half of that in spirit, so something simple and easy would be fun.

but only if your serious. Besides this one small element, the rest i can do with help from mappers, moddlers and skinners. That's it.

EDIT:
I'm plotting some basic layout for... well... the whole game. Nothing specific, just the general shape of each area and where they connect. I'm plop a pic soon.

ok, i got some ideas for simple scenes for Turnstile.

Ambush 1:
In a room with an involving puzzle that sucks the player into trying to solve the puzzle. After doing so and after a short delay, enemies warp in via warpballs and ambush the player in this odd arena.

Ambush 2:
Once entering a room, the safety locks on the doors in that room lock and leave you in a stand off with enemies. You must kill all of the enemies to unlock the doors or find a switch. Much like the traditional Zelda and Metroid games.

Map Style 1:
A general map style that is perfect for this mod is to branch out and give the player many paths to choose from, and perhaps b=must backtrack to explore where the other path goes. Such as two switches at the end of two paths, then back track and travel a third path to get to the door that blocked you earlier.

Map Style 2:
Making areas that are seperate from other rooms visible through window like structures in the wall. Sometimes an item on the other side may lead you to think about secrets and go back to check every n00k and cranny for any such secret passage.

Map Style 3:
Maps should be as pretty as possible, but functional. Like it appears as if the contraption you initiates follows the wall to another room. But the player is stopped by a window grate and must go around.

Map Style 4:
At certain points of the game, an event should happen where a section should cave in and change the path of the player completely.

Enemy 1:
In some parts of the game, ghost like monsters should appear and be much more difficult after the player has gained much since the last time in that area.

Enemy 2:
Random enemies, if possible.

Enemy 3:
Evil Clones?

Event 1:
It was recommended to me to make some climbing parts that has acid rising after you. I think it should be weak acid, so on the returning trip, the player has to sacrifice some life and swim through it to escape the area.

Event 2:
I want the ending to be like the intro. You come in on a train like in the intro of hl1, you suit up for the test. You beat the game, return through on the other side of the teleport, five feet from where you started, and the lab is destroyed because of the cascade. You escape on the same train you came in on. End of game. The ending isn't supposed to be flashy or special or cool. Just something weird and thought provoking.

Feedback please.

Souds. Awesome.

I love the fact you come all the way back to where you started to escape, very HL1ish.

I like the sound of some of the events you have, if I may suggest another?

Ambush 3: A room with a group of allies in the middle, all around enemies and other dangers (map based) are threatening to kill them, you must protect the allies (scientists) until they can open the path onwards for you.

i forgot about using allies. Uber Th4nks!

I'm gonna switch the format to something more workable. Instead of an RPG format, i'm gonna change it it to a discovery type game. Basically, your find all of your upgrades in "HEV Suit Booster Packs" and other such ups.

On another note:
The game will have accessibility milestones. Example:

-You can't go too far until you find the eepee to chop through vines that are covering certain doors.

-The Pistol allows you to shoot buttons that are out of reach in high places to open doors.

-If Possible, explosives will blast closed parts of certain areas open.

-Long jump will let you acccess new areas.

-A gravity diffuse upgrade will half your personal gravity. This opens more areas up to access.

-Spending specified amounts of suit energy to power and open doors.

-if possible. an upgrade that minimizes your crawling sized so you can fit through smaller crawl spaces. Only if possible though.

more feedback would be sweet.

EDIT:
i'm thinking this mod will have roughly 50 maps. Originally, HL has 96. So yeah, mapping help would be nice, but things need to get going first.

I'm using Spirit of Half-life 1.4 i think. I also found the source code so you can code it. anyone who wants some work might want to grab spirit.

Also, if you can pass me some links to the .smd exporter and all of that for 3ds max 8 or blender, that would really help out the developement.

Soon, a prefab map and a world layout will come around. DCC and I will layout the entire world in detail, so it might take a while. Probably a whole two months. Once then, and after a wad is made, mappers can map away.

If your jumpy for mapping, i advise you to grab the batch compiler, as much custom compile and lighting parameters will be used. All maps must seem to have the same lighting and compile style.

i found an awsome melee weapon. if anyone wants to model and skin it, be my guest. this would be just plain cool to have as a replacement to the crobar.

of course, when modelling, a simpler form would be better. but i like the whole cross thing. the fancy crap in the middle i could do without.
The split base of the blade is pimp, keeping that.

though it doesn't show, the blade is about 4 feet long.

Enemy 3:
Evil Clones?

Hehe,Just like in Xen Assault and in a mod that I didnt know,(which has otis's evil clone)
now every mod gonna get evil clone....

-You can't go too far until you find the eepee to chop through vines that are covering certain doors.

-The Pistol allows you to shoot buttons that are out of reach in high places to open doors.

-If Possible, explosives will blast closed parts of certain areas open.

-Long jump will let you acccess new areas.

So these are possible in every mod.I'm getting concerned about your expreince in sp mod/maps.

great ideas Rimrook.

now:

-You can't go too far until you find the eepee to chop through vines that are covering certain doors.
doable, although not in its entirety, breakable with ultrahigh health and instant crowbar ticked would do it.

-The Pistol allows you to shoot buttons that are out of reach in high places to open doors.
doable

-If Possible, explosives will blast closed parts of certain areas open.
breakables where they can't be shot, but only hit by splash damage.

-Long jump will let you acccess new areas.
doable

-A gravity diffuse upgrade will half your personal gravity. This opens more areas up to access.
sounds fun, but maybe have it toggleable so your not constantly half-assed floating around.

-Spending specified amounts of suit energy to power and open doors.
coding

-if possible. an upgrade that minimizes your crawling sized so you can fit through smaller crawl spaces. Only if possible though.
coding

and for the level design. have you played someplace else, its a great example of the double back technique that you should use. you start near a lift thats off, go under the part where you end to turn it on, take the lift up and end up running around that part you were just under, able to see where you were before. a nexus effects forms. and the areas all seem to be one place built onto itself. it is great for gameplay

I know the coding ones will be tough, yet i don't think they will be added. The energy one could become too difficult, as people would be running around searching for energy just to open a door.

I thought that the HEV suit has "Reactant Armor" so I was thinking that a player would regenerate suit power slowly. This compensates for the low amounts of Health and armor at the start. Given the starting stats are 10 Life and Energy. there will be 18 life support upgrades and 18 suit power upgrades overall, as well as the many other miscellaneous ups you'll find.

Before things start happening, i guess i need to know what will be done in code and if anyone will do it instead of saying "yeah, you need code for that."

I was thinking of making the gravity diffuser a weapon, only it's not a weapon. Clicking and holding will lower your gravity for jumping, and has an ammo limit that recharges similar to the Hornet gun. Again, more code. I like this idea, the whole personal gravity device.

breakables where they can't be shot, but only hit by splash damage.

I hope spirit has flags that will let me do this. This is a very important milestone.

The whole double back thing is just a weird realization for the player that they went through all of that to travel a few feet over. Only when you return, the lab has undergone the whole cascade look and you ride the train you came in on with gman or something.

-if possible. an upgrade that minimizes your crawling sized so you can fit through smaller crawl spaces. Only if possible though.
coding

Actually, you could do this with a cleaver setup of ents and a camera sequnce, seeing as how the camera is so buggy however it would be difficult.

All this sounds good, but wait, 50 maps! Whoaa, rim, start small mate. 50 maps is an insane ammount of work, try 10 or 20 and then make addons (Turnstile part 2) etc. 50 maps worth of work is far too long to wait for.

-You can't go too far until you find the eepee to chop through vines that are covering certain doors.
doable, although not in its entirety, breakable with ultrahigh health and instant crowbar ticked would do it.

Rimrook doesnt know about that!?!??!

Rimrook like any other mod leaders,start with sp maps.Your architecture are always been great and also your textures.But I think you lack of entity work a bit

Actually, you could do this with a cleaver setup of ents and a camera sequnce, seeing as how the camera is so buggy however it would be difficult.

Like in the adventure games,great idea Tycell

Map Style 1:
A general map style that is perfect for this mod is to branch out and give the player many paths to choose from, and perhaps b=must backtrack to explore where the other path goes. Such as two switches at the end of two paths, then back track and travel a third path to get to the door that blocked you earlier.

Map Style 2:
Making areas that are seperate from other rooms visible through window like structures in the wall. Sometimes an item on the other side may lead you to think about secrets and go back to check every n00k and cranny for any such secret passage.

Map Style 3:
Maps should be as pretty as possible, but functional. Like it appears as if the contraption you initiates follows the wall to another room. But the player is stopped by a window grate and must go around.

Map Style 4:
At certain points of the game, an event should happen where a section should cave in and change the path of the player completely

Excuse me but you dont have to tell everything like the map styles.Like I dont think we dont need to know these map styles unless they are something original.And these arent original...Every fps game has these.
For example what would happen if I say for my mod:

---

Map Style 1:The MaP must be super!excellent!damn good!AnD there should be explosions and aliens everYwHere.Wow!AnD other great Shit!Like the a cave which would Just crash Down aNd change the player's path!

---

I never thought saying this to you but it sounds lame.

UPDATES:This is a pic of the new egon gun. I like it alot.This is the pregraphic for a new sky set. I just took it into max, messed around a little and made a sky out of it. As seen below.An in-game of the sky. Also pointing out that block that is only destroyable by explosives, without code or anything extra

As of now:
NO NEW CODE WILL BE REQUIRED
as i figure things out, i won't need it and now i only need modelers and skinners. i need modifications for the:

Crowbar
9mm Handgun
9mm Assault Rifle
Shotgun
RPG
Grenade

I can build the model, but i can't do nothing more than that. I'll need someone to add the arm and animate it, then a skin it or pass it to a skinner. I'll try export the model to a workable format. Let me know which format you can use if you offer to model. Once done, the modifications are done and we can bring in the mapping. I'll be making all new skies and textures for each area, as well as a layout to somewhat follow by.

Post if you want to help out or have any thoughts please.

Try the HIT forums or the CStrike Forums for modelers / skinners.

: Maybe i should build every gun in 3d before i do that.

D: Making this for 1.6 will be more fun, traditional and good.

it's all good.

What's wrong with hl1 stuff anyway? are you all so quick to jump into the latest fads? i really don't care. Mostly, yes. hl1 is easier, the editor is well refined and non-buggy. Texturing is easier, easier to incorporate, smaller size for easy distribution, etc.

Why do i keep saying this? do you have no respect for my choices?

I don't think source is "better" but is only "different" from 1.6 stuff.

This thread is for MOD DEVELOPEMENT ONLY:
keep all of this crap to the shout box or if you want to, spam my pm inbox.

A: Source editor is appaling shit.

how so?

why do you seem to keep ignoring my posts?(sry,I tried to pm.But your box is full)

sry,I tried to pm.But your box is full

no it's not, it's completely empty. :
a glitch?

source IS BETTER THAN 1.6. FACE IT.

Fearian, you're a fucking idiot.

1) The source editor is REALLY REALLY TERRIBLE... and its buggy. Source games HAVE to be used with steam, so half the time you cant test the maps you've been working on because Steam has fucked up somehow.

2) HL1 was a better game, and the mapping is certainly better too.
HL2 was great, no doubt, but it just wasnt as good as HL1... It was all graphics and physics. And it didn't really follow up HL1 at all...

3) HL1 mapping is just plain fun... You do what you want to do, and making textures for it is soo easy.

4) HL2 mapping is like using a Mac... You are simply sharing the experiance, and if you get something done, so much the better. Its horribly buggy... And the editor.. its just nasty. It doesn't feel as good... Like it was made for people who blatantly play awp_map repeatedly...

[/rant]

@The Hunter: Even though it's buggy sometimes, I think the Source editor is a little bit better. Just the feature of being able to build brushes according to a selected one is something I hate the HL1 editor for not having. I saves so much time when you are making walls and you want them to have the same height etc.
Steam is the only problem I see with HL2 mapping. Making materials is not as difficult as I once thought. It's actually fun and there are so many incredible things you can't do with wad files.
I wont even comment on displacements since you have made dm_islandside. I dont suppose you'd like to do that with vertex manipulation..?
To be honest: Every single HL1 map can be done in Source, but the contrary is not true.
On the topic of Rimrook's maps, I still say they would have more potential with the new engine. But it doesnt matter. HL1 maps are still popular and people like them.

The source engine IS better. you cannot deny that. there are few obsticals to overcome but there is so much more that can be done in source.

Im not just jumping to the latest fads either. my last map release? HLDM. My current project, HLSP. I map for both, and at first I didnt like source, you cant get away with such simple brushwork, you can make a wad in 10 minuites, but when you spend time learning the alternative, its better.

you say that you enjoy pushing the 1.6 engine to its limits, well that may be true, but how far does that take you? the real fun in source is seeing what you can do with the new engine, and then pushing it to the max.

HL 1.6 is great, its an engine that has stood the test of time. I have great fun mapping for it and I love its simplicity. but SOURCE. IS. BETTER.

this is a long post so you could skip the next bit. its more aimed to be direct arguments to hunters comments.

NB.
Ive noticed that all your points are opinion based hunter. you say that HL2 wasnt as good as HL1. thats your opinion.
you say that HL1 is fun to map for. opinion. I agree but its not a fact. and its kind of irelivent if I find osurce more fun to map for.
point 4 and 1 are the same thing... so Il say this. just because some kid made bad awp maps for CSS, I geuss that means its a shitty editor huh? I geuss that if hammer crashes on you you just forget all the work youve done right? Ive been mapping since hammer was born and the bugs back then, and now, are far worse than in the source SDK. not to mention the S:SDK has features that I cant map without in 1.6

IS THIS THE REASON I DON'T MAP SOURCE!? OMGz0rz!!!

Source runs like shit on my machine. Blatantly, i can't see what i'm doing, i always have a laggy 5 frames per second, and the only part i like about the editor is the measurements and self-origin entities. The no-arbitrary lighting in the perspective view gets me lost with little depth perception. I'm hoping to up my rig, but not soon.

Don't think i haven't tried source mapping yet, i have, i kinda like it, but it's not going to help my career or my school work. My world is low-poly, and it'll stay that way for a while.

ciao

sry,I tried to pm.But your box is full

no it's not, it's completely empty.
a glitch?

I posted that in 14 feb and you responded in 16 feb.Ring any bells?Ring-Ring!

And that doesnt explains why did you ingnored my other posts that tells some of your weird behavior.