Any Help Appreciated Created 17 years ago2006-06-25 20:13:59 UTC by ClueLess

im completly new at creating maps for HL and finding it very difficult to accomplish what i need to do even using the guides on this site, to that end i was wondering if any one out there could, explain to me in the simplest terms posible how i go about the following:

1) when a player moves over an area displaying a message on screen only the first time they pass over it, (at present i am trying to use the trigger_once mechanic but it does not appear to be working sucessfully

2) check the items a player is carring and shift the "monsters" behaviour to hostile if the player is carring a certain item

3) end the level (i understand this is carried out with the trigger_end but i do not fully understand the "master" part of the properties

as i stated above i am new to this and any help would be very much appreciated.

Why do people so new, try things this advanced? Has anyone besides me ever wondered this peculiar event?

Because they want to be able to appeal to experienced mappers. Why shouldn't they want to? The harder it is the faster they'll learn, I say.

1) Doesn't work? A trigger_once should always work once, does it triggr it more than once or not trigger it at all?

2) Can't be done without new code.

3) Don't worry about it. If there is no multisource, the entity will think that its master is enabled by default.

I just speak from my perspective like you do yours. I am able to pick up on concepts very easily so I assume others will be able to pick it right up.

yeah same
if you understand the basics then advanced stuff isnt hard at all...
and the basics can be learnt in a few hours

1) just have a game_text be targetted by the trigger_once. Target field goes to name field.

2)If you pick up the items in one map (with good monsters) and then transition to another map (with the bad monsters) you can have this happen. If you really want it all in one map, you can tediously target each and every monster in the map with a multi_manager and teleport them into a room far away, and then spawn in evil monsters when the player walks over an item.

Orpheus I will take an e-piss on you! here I go! pisssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss sssssss sss s

Dang man multi_managers are the easiest entities. If you can't use those you can't map for anything but..like..deathmatch.

@Clueless (and welcome btw! )

Tutorials: I know this isn't what you want to hear, but I would recommend reading all the "In the beginning" tutorials again, followed by the HL entity guide here as well. Some of this stuff isn't gonna make very much sense to you until you're a little more familiar with Hammer, but like anything, there is a learning curve of some sort... So don't give up! HL Mapping is pretty easy once you get over the little hump

Decompiling: Decompiling allows you to see exactly how entity setups are done, in a real-world example. Decompiling destroys the brushes, so NEVER try to compile a decompiled map...just us it for learning how to do things. (Note: The aim of decompiling is not to steal people's work, but again, as a learning tool.)

Example Maps: There are tons of valuble examples to search through in the Map Vault here. I found this example map by Seventh-Monkey that addresses BOTH questions #1 and #3. (#2 as others have already told you is impossible without coding)

2)If you pick up the items in one map (with good monsters) and then transition to another map (with the bad monsters) you can have this happen. If you really want it all in one map, you can tediously target each and every monster in the map with a multi_manager and teleport them into a room far away, and then spawn in evil monsters when the player walks over an item.

Instead of changing the level you can just kill all the monsters(killtarget value) and afterward spawn monsters that are not prisoners using monstermakers.

Elon Yariv I will now take an e-piss on you.
.....
......
Crap, I'm out form last time. Let me go drink some watter.

Elon, it's pointless anyway, because how in the hell do you propose we "check the items a player is carrying" not to mention change the monsters... seriously

NOT feasible unless you modify HL's original source code afaik.

IDIOTS!!! As soon as he picks up the item (trigger_once anyone) he HAS THE ITEM!! This is so simple. Just have the trigger_once target a multi_manager which targets for teleporting. This is NOT hard, you just have to trick the player.

You don't need the freaking item to do anything, just put a trigger right under it.

You're right, after thinking about it a little more, it doesn't seem too complicated.

My apologies to Elon and VOX.

Why not post a simple map to shush us detractors once and for all Methinks it would make a very interesting example

first off thanks to every one who replyed, especaly Elon and Vox for giving some ideas as to other ways of solving the problem.

Orpheus, thanks for the luck, but i didnt try some thing this advanced out of choice, it was kind of dumped on me as a project to finish up some one elses work....... not easy when you've no idea how to go about it.

rowleybob, the example map helped a lot thanks.

oh yeh Worldcraft dude if you need to piss so much i surgest you visit a doctor as you may have some thing seriously wrong with you

I havn't tried the killtarget way of getting rid of them, dunno if it will work or not.

--Later

Oh em gee it worked! Elon your way is much more practical than my way haha. Here are your steps Clueless

Name each of your monsters that the player actually sees before he gets the item, have them all be the same name
Set a trigger_once under your item
Have it's "killtarget" be the name. Now all the monsters disappear, and you can spawn in evil ones with monstermakers.

Don't use trigger_once, make the weapon killtarget the monsters and target the monstermakers! Just like I did in this map, only with an item_suit.

Edit:

In this map I made a mechingun trigger a cople of repeling grunts! Check the small cave with the vains and headcrabs!

It really is a fun little....trigger setup isn't it? Thanks for asking the question in the first place Clueless, never would have thought of this.

based on the advice given by people on here, i have managed to solve 1 & 3, and i think using Elon's method i have almost solved 2, so far:

A)picking up the item, targets & displays a message

B)which should if im understanding it right target the multi-manager?

C)then passing through the door way activates another trigger that displays another message, and targets the multi manager?

D) with both of these targeting the multi-manager, it then kills all the monster called "a", and targets the monster makers called "b"

E) spawns a monster, there is 1 monster maker for each of the monsters killed with the previous kill selection

however im not sure if im understanding this multi-manager right, and also i am still not able to get the monstermakers to spawn the new monsters, the current configeration for them is:

name: b
monster type: monster_zombie
childrens name: <blank>
No monsters: 1
frequency: 1
max alive: 1

flags: start on <ticked>

cyclic <ticked>
monster clip <ticked>

can any one see any obvious problems?

The start on flag means it will start spawning right after the level is loaded. You probebly don't want it so untick the flag. The monsterclip flag means the monsters created by that multimanager will be blocked by the monsterclip entities. The cyclic flag means after the maker spawned once it will spawn again untill all it's monsters are gone, This has no affect since it may spawn only one monster.

So as I understand, apart from the replacemant of the monsters, you want a message to show up after the item is picked and after you pass a certian doorway, is that right?
I'll tell you what you need to do!

Give all the "prisoner"(friendly) monsters the same name. Copy that name to the items killtarget value, and now all the monsters will disapear as soon as you pick up the gun. Make the gun target a multimanager. That multimanager will target with no delay(0) the first game_message(not sure of the name, but choose the game entity, not the env_message) and maybe an ambient Generic that will play some nice little beep or some other kind of sound when the gun it picked up. That multimanager will also trigger all the monster makers, make sure they all have the same name.

For the second message you'll need to use a multisource or a trigger_changetarget, since you don't want it to work untill you take the item. Here are the two simplest ways to do so:(the second one is simpler)

1) Make the multimanager target the multisource. Copy the multisources name to the message entity's master value. After you'll pick up the weapon the multisource will be switched on and the message will now work when triggered, but wont work before the gun is picked up. Make the door target the message and you're done.

See the second way to do it, it's simpler, but alas the trigger_changetarget is overlooked by most mappers. It's a very usefull entity.

2) Don't make the door target the message at all! Make the multimanager target a trigger_changetarget. That tigger will target the door and in the newtarget vaule write the name of that message entity. When the item is picked the trigger_changetarget will change the doors target a newtarget, the message.

ok as it stands now i have just 3 remaining problems

1) how do you enable part of a multisource on map load?
2) how do you then have a button turn it off?
3) is there any reason why my monster makers dont make monsters?

Elon your advice above helped alot but i think iv confused you with the order of things:

1)user enters room
2)user picks up item + recives warning
3a)if user presses button the are free to leave (relates to 1+2 ^ )
3b)if not when they leave 'some' of the monsters are replaced with therir evil twins, (using the kill/make method from earlier), an attack them.

unfortunatly the monster makers i have in place dont seam to be generating any monsters, is there any trick to it?

It might be a simple problem of you don't have the name of the onster correctly spelled. Make sure the name of the monster equals the name in the entity box. monster_slave or whatever.

checked that vox, but the problem appears to be with either my multisource or multimanager i think........tho the problem could be godzila destroying tokyo for all my knowledge of the matter

item trigger + door button
> multisource
> multimanager
> open door + monstermaker + kill

this is how i have them set up at the moment, and no monsters are spawning nor is the door opening but if i take both of the multi's out and direct target either the maker or the door both work fine :