models vs. prefabs Created 19 years ago2004-09-10 04:52:56 UTC by rowleybob

one example of this i thought was cool was the jeb sprinfield model in de_simpsons. at first looking at the statue i thought "holy crap, how did he build this statue using vhe?" but then when i looked at the map files, it turned out the statue was a model and not a prefab.

for example, rather than building an apc or toilet, or anything using texturing and prefabs, use models for greater detail and realism, than would be possible using vhe.

besides the added time in creating the models, would having lots of static models also slow down gameplay, like too many prefabs, and what are some other potential downsides of this practice?

(Prefabs? Why do people always call detail things prefabs? I often make details myself, unique, for that map only.)

Prop models (as models used for details are often called) are very usefull for smaller and more detailed objects. For larger things like APC's their different lighting can quickly become pretty obvious. This can turn out very ugly but when done right it can also look just fine.

It's really a decision of the mapper where to use prop models and where to use solid geometry. Sometimes models are your only solution, sometimes they're just a good option and sometimes they would require too much time when you look at what value it really adds to the map.

The benefits of models would be (in my opinion):
1. No increase of compile time.
2. Prefab-like usage: easy to implement and easy to use again.
3. Modifying a model doesn't require you to recompile the map. Good for testing purposes.
4. Less effect on fps.
5. More (small) details possible.
6. Models can be animated.

The disadvantages:
1. No entity in HL seems to suit really so it requires a some .fgd modifications.
2. Different lighting. Models take their lighting from the world face they are above, wich can result in badly lit models.
3. They can take too much time to create (think of deadlines).

I have a real problem with number 3 on the disadvantage

You mean, you see it as a disadvantage also? Or you disagree?

Anyway, after all it's just from my experience and so may not count for everyone...

Model pro: You can rip...err import 'em from other games.
Model con: I still cant use milkshape (which is prolly expired by now)

I bought Milkshape (only 25 euro) and I'm pretty well used to it now. It's a bit hard at first but very workable when you get the basics down. There's quite a lot of tutorials on Chumbalum's site, too, so it shouldn't be a problem for those that really want to learn it.

I really hate Milkshape for being commercial.
They earn money with a simple program, with the only purpose to convert models from one game to another.
It is totally unhandy for creating models. There are other programs for free that are much better, such as blender.
I'll probably buy it too, when they provide a .blend to .m3d (milkshape format) converter.

By the way, as CP already said, stop calling little environment detail 'prefabs'!
Please! It's absolutely wrong.
Prefab means that it was pre-fabricated. So you've made it once to use it whenever you need it.

CP already compiled a pro and con list, so I won't say anything else.

Thanks! Very helpful. i've found milkshape a little arcane to work with too, so i probably won't be making custom models anytime soon--i'm still trying to get a handle on hammer! still, it's cool to know you have another option for subverting the shortcomings of vhe.

i'd probably be better served, spending time with texturing tricks for most cases than models i guess. it never ceases to amaze me, the creative use of texturing in other's maps.

That's where the screenshot key comes in handy .

What I like to do is walk around maps that I find inspiration from and screenshot areas that look good to me, along with screenshotting the lights, doors, floors, walls....all sorts of parts of the map to draw inspiration from whilst mapping.

On the topic...prop models can make decent levels look great. For example, trash models in a city street level can really add to the detail, while paper and pen/pencil models could add to an office level. Just don't go over the top with their implementation.

for instance (AHEM mop) making the keys on a keyboard individual brushes (AHEM)

lol. rabid, that's a good idea with using f5. i shall try that too. thanks!