Sledge (Hammer Alternative) Alpha Build Created 4 years ago2013-07-27 02:24:39 UTC by Penguinboy Penguinboy

Created 4 years ago2013-07-27 02:24:39 UTC by Penguinboy Penguinboy

Posted 3 years ago2014-11-22 16:56:41 UTC Post #322450
No mapping still has a lot of magic, it's the fact that I just have other work to do. Though making money on maps through the workshop sounds like something EVERYONE would do... What are the chances of anyone actually making a good amount of it?
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-22 18:02:06 UTC Post #322451
Penguin, this doesn't sound like too hard of an addition, but could you add a new preset brush type which is just a "carved" cylinder will all vertices moved to the edges of it's bounding box
Like this :
User posted image
shit explanation I know
Instant Mix Instant MixTitle commitment issues
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-22 20:00:56 UTC Post #322453
^

Genius.

Yes please! :D
Alberto309 Alberto309GTX 660 Ti OC
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-23 03:32:40 UTC Post #322456
Yeah I'm down with that as a thing.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-23 06:39:28 UTC Post #322457
What are the chances of anyone actually making a good amount of it?
The chances pretty good imo, considering your skills/knowledge, and the fact you are familiar with CS is a BIG plus.

Rabideh's cs_hijack is basically #1 on the workshop right now, and the only reason it might not make an operation is because them map is partially a port from MW2(that's what people are commenting, I never played mw2), but otherwise that map would be guaranteed to make an operation.

If you map makes an operation, you get a percentage of the sales of crates and special items offered during the 90 days the operation runs. I don't know how much you would make, but I'm guessing, $25-50,000 or more.

Instant Mix
Excellent idea! In the meantime keep the shape handy as a prefab, and scale it to the size needed. You can keep it on-grid by scaling at certain increments, though I can't remember offhand what they are ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-25 21:51:26 UTC Post #322474
Feature Request:

Brush Stroke*:
Used in the same way as hollow, using this function would create a brush-based wireframe of the selected solid.
Negative values for outside strokes, positive values for inside strokes.
User posted image
*lol
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-26 12:08:56 UTC Post #322479
That's an interesting idea Archie. My only question would be what to do with the corners.. it might be nice if Sledge automatically mitred the joints?

Maybe PB could someday add this as a wireframe primitive? Also a skybox primitive might be nice, or possibly make it a toggle option for Hollow to sort the edges?

Whitelist addon request
I would like to be able to choose a "Primary" WAD in the texture whitelist, which would mean any duplicate texture names from other WADS would be eliminated from the texture browser list. right now I use wally to manually delete duplicates, no big deal
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-26 16:10:02 UTC Post #322482
Brush Stroke
Me like.
it might be nice if Sledge automatically mitred the joints?
It would be better to have an option to choose between mitred and not mitred. You don't need mitred joints on every structure.
a skybox primitive
Nah. You just need a prefab for it, then you just scale it or resize it with the VM tool. It would be a waste of time for PB imho. Also because you don't need cubic skyboxes every single time.
Whitelist addon request
That would be useful. Or simply add something that excludes duplicated textures everytime instead, no matter what.
*lol
Perv. lel
Alberto309 Alberto309GTX 660 Ti OC
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-26 18:20:36 UTC Post #322484
That would be useful. Or simply add something that excludes duplicated textures everytime instead, no matter what.
The only problem is how to choose which wad's textures you want, e.g. i have custom DEV textures to resemble source, and if some other WAD has an aaatrigger brush, I'd wouldn't want my textures excluded ;)
Nah. You just need a prefab for it, then you just scale it or resize it with the VM tool.
True :) I'm guessing a tool like this would only work with cubes, but it would be neat if you could do other shapes without error; It would be like an advanced Hollow tool basically :)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-26 19:23:05 UTC Post #322485
Rather than choosing one primary WAD, you could sort them by priority and the first would override all repeat textures in the others, and so on. Having only one like you said would only work if the first WAD held ALL the textures.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-27 11:46:44 UTC Post #322497
^ That sounds good Stu =)

PB
Is there a way to change the default save type to RMF? I thought there was... I started using RMF format only due to problems with VMF

Check for Problems add-on request
Like the entity report, add a delete button OR allow the the delete key to remove highlighted items from the list.
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-27 16:01:35 UTC Post #322500
I'm guessing a tool like this would only work with cubes, but it would be neat if you could do other shapes without error; It would be like an advanced Hollow tool
Yeah, it might be helpful in some cases, indeed.
you could sort them by priority and the first would override all repeat textures in the others
Genius, SugarMan!
Check for Problems add-on request
Like the entity report, add a delete button OR allow the the delete key to remove highlighted items from the list.
I agree. Also, do you know those annoying errors like "func_whatever is empty" just because you've deleted a brush entity BEFORE moving it to world? Those one should be removed completely imho. Though, I don't remember if Sledge notices these type of "fake errors".

@PB:

Why are you rewriting everything? Did I missed something? :o
Alberto309 Alberto309GTX 660 Ti OC
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-27 19:25:42 UTC Post #322503
Because rewriting is hip.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-27 23:38:50 UTC Post #322510
@Alberto: The same question was asked on Github, here was my response:

[quote]
I'm doing a big rewrite of the UI in an effort to support things I want to add in the future. The most important reasons are:
  • Linux/Mac support (hopefully, though Mono might not be complete enough to work properly)
  • Multi-language support (definitely)
  • Support for plugins (eventually)
  • Multi-user mapping over the Internet (eventually)
  • A more robust & context-sensitive command system like the Source 2 Hammer Editor
  • More nice things to make things easier for me
Since I'm working on something like this, the main branch isn't moving right now, but work is still happening!
[/quote]
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-27 23:44:34 UTC Post #322511
Ey
I dunno if this is something that has already been covered. So sorry if it has been.

So if I'm understanding correctly, the FGD tells the entities in the 3D view what models/sprites to use. Like Monster_Barney, it will display that entity with a barney model.
But say you're using an FGD that displays entities as colored blocks, is it possible for Sledge to have the option to ignore what the FGD says and display entities as models/sprites from a selected folder?

I've been using Half-Life_3.5.3.fgd for the longest time and am used to seeing things such as Multimanager looking like a logic sprite from Source SDK. Since switching over to SOHL, they look different now and it's fugly.

So, is this possible? Or is it entirely up to the FGD being used.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 00:51:41 UTC Post #322515
Sledge will use the sprites from the game folder before anything else, so you can copy the sprites into your game folder (overwrite the SOHL ones) and it should work.

If you're using Steam HL, you can use the SteamPipe system - create a folder called "modname_addon" (e.g. "cstrike_addon") and put the sprites in there - they will be used instead of the sprites in the base mod folder.

Example:
SteamApps/Common/Half-Life
SteamApps/Common/Half-Life/modname [sohl sprites are in here]
SteamApps/Common/Half-Life/modname_addon [your custom sprites are in here]

The directory structure should be the same for both folders (there should be "sprites" and "models" subfolders, etc).
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 00:55:03 UTC Post #322516
Understood. Thanks!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 17:11:18 UTC Post #322522
Could this big rewrite potentially open up a possibility for a user-end scripting language like python, LUA, or something?

I want to make stuff for Sledge too ya know.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 17:52:40 UTC Post #322523
That rewrite looks exciting PB, godspeed sir! =P

Btw, I'm finding the rotate widget very useful. Effortlessly being able to change the pivot point is awesome stuff! It would be effortless to make some simple env_render animations now :P

Rim: Python looks pretty neat. I've obviously heard of it before, but never understood that's what it was about. Really interesting! :)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 18:27:56 UTC Post #322524
Last post from me until I have something more useful to add..
But I wanted to just thank you for the hard work, PB. Sledge is not without its problems, but it's damn good and makes life easier. c:
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 18:54:15 UTC Post #322525
^

You can really streamline your workflow due to nearly everything being customizable, as well the new-and-improved features make it hard to go back to Hammer... Most-all the major bugs are fixed now; Sledge is truly a joy to work with ;)
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-28 19:42:53 UTC Post #322526
Because rewriting is hip.
wat
@Alberto: The same question was asked on Github
Oh I'm sorry Pengy, I don't look at Github unfortunately. :/ Thanks for the info though. I agree with you on your decision to rewrite everything for the things you've said!
python, LUA
Holy shit yes please! :D
Alberto309 Alberto309GTX 660 Ti OC
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-29 02:20:54 UTC Post #322529
@Rim: Yeah, I want to support a scripting language eventually. Python will probably be the one I choose because there's a good .NET library for it. I want to have it for plugins as well as a command-line in the UI itself that you can run once-off changes on. The rewrite wont immediately allow for plugins/scripting, but it's definitely something I want to add eventually.
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-29 15:38:32 UTC Post #322534
I'll post here so you won't forget to add an option for snap objects to grid like in hammer
https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Hammer_Hotkey_Reference#Grid

CTRL + SHIFT + B.
It would be really useful :)

Better explaination :
You chose vertexes of an object and if they aren't on the grid it would snap them to the grid.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 00:09:30 UTC Post #322537
I'm having the same texture misalignment problem that was brought up earlier. It appears normal in Sledge and offset in-game - see below. Note I didn't run rad for that compile, but it happens no matter what. It's only happening to a certain few custom textures - that picture has two, and only one didn't work. It doesn't have to do with the left one being tied to the func_door_rotating, since the misalignment is happening for world brushes too. I checked the scales, and they're not overly precise (two decimals). I also tried both ZHLT 3.4 and VHLT v33 to compile the map. I'm not sure what to do with it. Anyone have any ideas?
User posted image
Oh, and i'm also experiencing a bug where the compiler doesn't always run the game when done (or ask to), despite having set it in the options.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 00:22:43 UTC Post #322538
Haven't popped into sledge yet to check, but I'm using Hammer 4x and running finding this an annoyance, so I'd like to ask - does sledge enforce on-grid vertices when creating arches? If not, can we please get a checkbox for rounding up vertex positions?
JeffMOD JeffMODCall 141.12
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 01:20:22 UTC Post #322539
@padrogue: try toggling the numbers up and down in the texture tool, I don't know if it will help but it's worth a shot. (i.e. press "up" on all 4 number boxes, and then press "down" on them all)

How does the texture appear in Hammer? Fixing the alignment in Hammer might fix the problem, I don't think Sledge would "unfix" it unless you edit the face again.

@Jeffmod: There's a checkbox in Sledge that does that.
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 01:48:40 UTC Post #322540
It's aligned in Hammer, and compiling it with Hammer (using ZHLT and VHLT) looked normal in-game. I also tried a different map in Sledge and the misalignment happened for some stock textures too (from halflife.wad).

The nudge trick unfortunately didn't work. I even tried flipping its alignment, but it was still offset when using Sledge.

EDIT:

I solved the game launch problem, and it showed me a bug. Turns out the game launch only happens when using a temp directory to compile, rather than the map directory, which I had been trying to use. When using the map directory to compile, it also copied an older BSP file into \valve\maps.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 01:59:35 UTC Post #322541
If you have time, could you copy that brush into a standalone RMF file and upload it somewhere? I think the issue might have something to do with how Hammer and Sledge generate .MAP files and it would be useful to be able to compare both programs using your example.
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 02:45:02 UTC Post #322542
I couldn't replicate the problem in a bare bones map. But, I looked at the MAP exports from Sledge and Hammer and sure enough, the textures were misaligned in the Sledge MAP but not in the Hammer one.

It's a pretty large map area. I could strip it down a bit (consolidate some custom stuff) and upload that somewhere if it'd help.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 03:00:41 UTC Post #322543
The difference between the two MAP exports for that face might be enough to help. If you could just paste in the relevant line from each MAP export, it might give me a hint as to what the issue is. (Though, if you're having trouble replicating it, it might not be that easy)
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 03:50:29 UTC Post #322544
@Jeffmod: There's a checkbox in Sledge that does that.
Sweet, already thought of! You're the best! <3
JeffMOD JeffMODCall 141.12
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 04:00:04 UTC Post #322545
From Hammer:
( 1795 3044 296 ) ( 1795 3044 320 ) ( 1795 2996 320 ) SIGN_PEAK10ACC6 [ 0 -1 0 106.667 ] [ 0 0 -1 42.6667 ] 0 0.1875 0.1875
From Sledge:
( 1795.000 3044.000 296.000 ) ( 1795.000 3044.000 320.000 ) ( 1795.000 2996.000 320.000 ) sign_peak10acc6 [ 0.000 -1.000 0.000 106.667 ] [ 0.000 0.000 -1.000 42.667 ] 0.000 0.188 0.188
Huh, so it looks like there was texture scale rounding error, from 0.1875 to 0.188. That 4-digit precision is from the Fit function. Of course, both Hammer and Sledge show that further rounded to 0.19, which is why I couldn't tell there was a problem.

Upon fixing that and recompiling in Sledge, I got the following values, and the texture was (relatively) aligned.
( 1795.000 3044.000 296.000 ) ( 1795.000 3044.000 320.000 ) ( 1795.000 2996.000 320.000 ) sign_peak10acc6 [ 0.000 -1.000 0.000 149.000 ] [ 0.000 0.000 -1.000 20.000 ] 0.000 0.190 0.190
So the problem here looks like bad handling of single-precision float to decimal integer conversion. I dunno if you can get into Hammer's code, but there's obviously something different with how it's handling that conversion.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 04:52:32 UTC Post #322546
It's very strange that the alignment is fine with Hammer's 0.1875, but not with Sledge's 0.188. I'd say it's more of a problem with how the compile tools are reading the MAP file, but I couldn't say for sure. That's a very odd error.

I think the easiest solution is simply to limit the output to two decimal places in the MAP file (i.e. use 0.19 instead of 0.188), even if that is slightly different to what Hammer does. If you agree with that fix, I'll create an issue in the bug database to make that change. Thanks for helping with the bug diagnosis! :)
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 05:11:34 UTC Post #322547
That sounds like that should work. That 0.0005 difference in texture scale is so small that it alone couldn't account for the misalignment. It was how that rounding affected the texture shift. You'll notice how the fixed version pretty drastically shifted the yz position of the texture (+42, -23).

The texture just reverts to the broken version after pressing Fit, so if you're going to limit to 2 decimals, that would be a good place to insert that code. That and Center. All the other texture align tools are probably okay since they aren't dealing with any kind of fractions.

Also happy to help, I do this stuff for work sometimes anyways.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 05:16:54 UTC Post #322548
Yeah, good idea on making the change in the texture tool, that way the result in Sledge should look exactly the same as the result in the exported MAP.

I'll make the change when I can, but I'm working on a large restructure at the moment so it might take a while until it arrives.
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 05:25:35 UTC Post #322549
Later's better than never. Thanks for the work.
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 17:35:40 UTC Post #322552
Are you not able to keybind the the WASD keys, or am I daft and just don't see them?
I use an odd ASDF for FPS games, with F&A Back/forth, and S&D for strafe

Also can you bind the options screen to a hotkey? I seem to spend a lot of time in there managing WADs.. I just noticed the button, nice =P

2 cents on the look of tool icons
I think sledge's tool icons would look better with a more standardized style, i.e. fewer colors and simpler design, making them more-easily recognizable. The current ones are just a bit visually distracting to me, even tho I use hotkeys anyway :P

Texture Browser search field note
When you select a new package(WAD), the search field should be cleared imo ;)

Text tool Note
I was very pleasently surprised to find the Text tool supports Alt codes! =PP
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 18:46:37 UTC Post #322554
I use an odd ASDF for FPS games, with F&A Back/forth, and S&D for strafe
I just threw up in my mouth.
Archie ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 22:17:51 UTC Post #322558
That seems kinda weird. Doesn't that take up more fingers? I mean, thou can'st not go backwards and forwards at the same time. I could even see it making (marginally) more sense to use something like WSDF, and just use the middle and index finger for the same mutually-exclusive reasons.
Jessie JessieLadytype
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 22:30:29 UTC Post #322559
It has advantages and disadvantages imo. If I had it to do over again, I would have stuck with the default movement keys back when I started playing CS, since every game defaults to WSAD for movement...

Here is a keymap I use for Insurgency, which probably uses the most keys of any fps I play:

F-forward
s/d-strafe
A-back
q-crouch
w-run
t-prone
t(while running)-slide
c-lean left
v-lean right
x-select fire
z-explosives
g-flashlight

That's not all of them, but you get the idea.
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-11-30 22:31:25 UTC Post #322560
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-01 10:51:52 UTC Post #322561
A simplified tool icons mockup for Sledge, just for fun:
User posted image
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-01 14:44:12 UTC Post #322570
Just imagine. Imagine hammer looked nice
User posted image
Not fitting at all, having such a mac-like UI, but would strongly recommend looking at Dribbble, some of the stuff people upload is incredible.
Instant Mix Instant MixTitle commitment issues
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-01 16:52:07 UTC Post #322574
Ok agreed Instant. How about keep the icons as they are, except only color the active tool? Maybe just desaturating the inactive ones a bit would do the trick
Captain Terror Captain Terrorwhen a man loves a woman
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-02 02:50:28 UTC Post #322582
Having a bit of an issue.
I created a new game configuration and all that stuff, and am using only two wads for this project from the mod's folder.
While mapping with that configuration, the texture browser will not display any of the two wads I chose and is only letting me choose wads from previous game configs, that don't even exist anymore and are from different folders.
I removed the texture cache folder's contents from appdata/roaming/sledge thinking that would help but it didn't.
Wat do.
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-02 02:55:02 UTC Post #322583
If a psuedo-minimalistic scheme is added to Sledge, I will shoot myself on live camera.
Suparsonik SuparsonikWithstood the post-nuke test.
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-02 02:55:07 UTC Post #322584
You might have forgotten to save your config... Go in to the settings and make sure they applied correctly. If it's still not working after restarting Sledge, try renaming the settings.vdf file in appdata and starting from a blank config (close the program before doing anything).
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-02 03:20:41 UTC Post #322585
Nope. Didn't work.
It seems to be using every wad from every mod folder except the one I set it up to use, if that makes sense.
Posted 3 years ago2014-12-02 05:01:57 UTC Post #322588
You might have put the wads you want in the blacklist instead of the whitelist. Try moving the wad names to the text box on the other side. Check all your config to make sure it's set up correctly. If it still looks wrong, maybe post the settings file on pastebin (and maybe the directory structure of your game/mod folders) and I'll see if I notice anything incorrect.

Edit: along with that, a screenshot of the (incorrect) wad list in the texture browser might help as well.
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
You must be logged in to post a response.