Post your screenshots! WIP thread Created 16 years ago2007-12-16 00:58:58 UTC by doodle

1280x1024 (A very low end resolution)

Since when 1280x1024 is a very low end resolution?

Also that raven city mod is nothing special. At least perhaps you're giving us bad examples. Please impress me.

since 90% of monitors sold today are 1920x1080

since 90% of monitors sold today are 1920x1080

And 200 Hz to add to that.

I knew Huntey would show up eventually.

anyway, you're right Cstriker. These screenshots do absolutely NO justice to the engine.

Then why show them? Show what it can really do.

I'm still interested in hearing about the shadow/lighting capabilities...

Then why show them? Show what it can really do.

I imagine It's not to show the engine to it's fullest, but to just show a couple of the basic engine features instead.

If it was still the way it is, then bringing a chopper down, would bring basically your whole PC down.

Maybe it does? This is why I asked...
For all I know the game runs at 1fps when rendering the helicopter crash.

Give me a gameplay video of a intel integrated running half-life at even 1280x1024 (A very low end resolution) at at least 30 fps, if it can't even do that, how could it draw 'standard gameplay effects' at even 1024x768?

Minimum spec for HL1 is very low; even an integrated card provided it's not ancient should be able to play the game and draw some sprites without dropping to unplayable framerates considering how old the game is, as far as I know the minimum spec is simply a card with VGA... maybe it can't do it at at 1280x, but the screenshot is 1024x.

Then why show them? Show what it can really do.

qft

Your arugment that it's a superior engine to Source is completely invalid until you can prove it, showing us what we've seen so far is certainly not helping, if anything it's helping to reinforce the opposite.

You really can't show what it can do in a couple on screenshots.

you'd have to experience it for yourself to actually know what it's like.
Infact, you can't really show what ANY engine can do in screenshots.

Comparing GoldSource with Source is like pitting a hamster against a Siberian tiger.

Yes the GoldSource engine can be enhanced and improved upon, but the fact of the matter is when people do this, they simply mimic features that the source engine can do as standard.

True, you cannot determine an engines possibilities from a few screenshots......but you can certainly get a good idea of them.

I was gone for a few days and you're still going on about this? lol. kids.

Minimum spec for HL1 is very low; even an integrated card provided it's not ancient should be able to play the game and draw some sprites without dropping to unplayable framerates

It still has to draw as many pixels on the screen that the game is running at, have you even tried running half-life (Original\Vanilla\Unmodified) on a integrated graphics card (Please keep your mobile ati HD radeon 5000 series out of this, that's just stupid.) at your monitors native resolution? Chances are, it doesn't work. If THAT doesn't work, what makes you think something even the slightest bit more complicated will work better?

Another thing after looking at the screenshot, it looks like the engine has over 4 (!) particles running at the exact same time, all overlapping.

Ever tried recreating 'mass physics' in gmod with explosives? Yeah, that slows down your computer.

Where did I ever say it would work better? Sprites are sprites, they're relatively cheap and are inexpensive in vanilla goldsrc so the game can render several of them (yes even on an integrated chipset) without dropping to 12fps, so it's safe to assume that something derived from that engine should be able to render several sprites without dropping to an unplayable framerate. But it's certainly not going to perform BETTER than vanilla goldsrc, I could have told you that at the beginning of this discussion.

The reason I asked the question was to try and determine if the performance problems were a result of the engine or the computer, not arguing for one engine over the other.

I've never tried running it at my monitor's native resolution; I doubt an integrated card would even support my native resolution. But chances are that if you're running integrated graphics you're not going to be running a gigantic HD display or an equally huge monitor; you're probably running at 800x600 or 1024x768. I'm not talking about a mobile series card, I'm talking about an integrated chipset which meets the minimum spec.

Comparing particles to full-blown physics simulation, I'm just laughing here, haha. You can't even compare the two; four particle systems (which look abominable compared to what Source can do, btw) should not slow down a game to an unplayable framerate. Maybe if there were 3000 particles, but there's no more than two dozen onscreen (and not much else)

This is entirely irrelevant because the engine is still not better than Source...admittedly, the Source engine will not run on an integrated chipset, but who uses integrated cards for gaming anyway?

True, you cannot determine an engines possibilities from a few screenshots...

...but you can certainly get a good idea of them.

Thank you for posting this, I was going to post some hl2 screenshots to reiterate my point but this is a better example

Wow, tis beautiful Urby, well done! Wait.. did you make that?

Haha. I can't do shit with Source. Sadly I am still a Goldsource guy.

Yeah, it's from Dear Esther. You can see my the best of my ability here

Well, I'm bailing from this as it's gone way too far.

So, to make you guys happy, Goldsource is shitty compared to Source and It's my opinion that it's better than Source.

There, let's just leave it at that. This is a damned WIP thread so let's use it for WIPs not arguments.

u mad bro?

ah righton

"u mad bro?"

Uh, useless account to post a useless comment much?

Of course, how else would I post? You're obviously annoyed that none of your arguments were/are valid.

Wait, nevermind.

Look, I'm not going to get in an argument with you if that's what you're trying to do.

Falling for the obvious Troll.

Btw, I'm not sure if I'll be able to finish my map since I have almost no time on my hands, but I'll try to get it in at least playing condition.

Hmm Yes I can do that for you, I'll charge like $250 for you to go down on me.. hmm actually bj's are nice so I'll only charge $200, holiday special!

oh wait you guys are no longer fighting or did I post in the wrong forum... ....

Trying to change the topic has failed.

For the sake of the thread...rubble, rubble everywhere!

mm, looks nice.

good work!

edit blocked lulzworking on my level of detail a bit

...and by that I mean level of rubble.

Where's the TWHL "like" button?

That's really good Blitz, I'm not sure if I'll be able to beat you... but anyway here's my little Cuban environment:

WARNING: Hammer screen.For 2muchvidyagames' version of PQL. etc. etc.

[EDIT]: Hmm, a little odd. Apparently, AFPMB (on those crates) means... http://www.afpmb.org/

Constantly working underground had started to inflict severe psychological damage upon the Central Administration personnel, so the suits up top decided to fit these artificial windows to brighten spirits. Their cool blue glow doesn't quite capture the warmth of sunlight, but it's better than the framed oil painting of Breen which used to hang there.

The Black Mesa legal team advise me to point out that I have never seen the film Resident Evil. I've never even heard of it, in fact.

Updated:Updated again:

It looks very real and the atmosphere you created is really nice. Especially the first version.

That's some nice brushwork you got there. Puts everything I've made in GS to shame.

I started working on a new gmod map. Why do I do gmod maps? Because I just don't have the skill to design an SP map yet. And it lets me explore my creativity without adding a story. I plan on doing this map a bit more interesting. It will be named gm_abysslift, for an obvious reason.No, the whole map is not a lift(the screenshot is just a "teaser"). But it is the central ... attraction, if I can say so.
For the moment, I only planned 2 "floors": one at the top, and one at the bottom. But I might add one at the middle. and different small room along the path of the elevator. The hard part is now designing the lift controls.

The problem I am currently facing is that the controls are moving with the lift, and I don't know if it's a good ideea to include controls at the main floors or not.

Btw blitzkrieg, the lighting looks cool in your map.

use Propper on those criss-crossing beams.

what is the distinction of using proppering them as opposed to making them func_illusionary or func_detail? i've esperimented with Propper a little bit, and propper models near as i can tell render same as brush entities..

I asked Huntey and he said it considerably lowers the compiling times and improves the map performance.

compile time especially. You won't notice much of a difference until a map starts getting very complicated, but propper has seriously reduced my compile times in the past.

Do propped brushes still split the faces of abutting brushes? Is there any specific reason it's better than func_detailing?

No, prop models won't split brushes beneath them so it's good to avoid splitting and other nasty things which happen during BSP.

Yes; source has a defined limit on brushes, brush faces, verts etc. Also when you func_detail things and they touch world brushes they create waterindices/t-junctions which can prevent a map from compiling at all if you get too many. Converting everything to a prop_static significantly reduces these counts but won't impact performance, necessarily. Also the difference is that props are vertexlit or lit from their origin while brushes are lightmapped, so the lighting on props looks much worse. You can avoid this in the orangebox by using -staticproppolys and -staticproplighting in the vrad parameters, although you might have to split your model into a few pieces instead of one giant brush.

Well, I posted to the wrong thread. I am tired I guess :P.

Another WIP screen from gm_abysslift:Yes, there are some problems. Such as the texture in the right not being aligned correctly. I only noticed when taking the screenshot lol.
The 2 blue screens you see in the distance are 2 of 6 controls welded to the lift.

I am happy with the progression of my map. If my mapping enthusiasm keeps like this for long and I have sufficient free time from school, I will finish this map in a month, rather than half a year(gm_nightfield).

Do something about that lighting in general. It's all yellow and makes your map look a lot uglier than you probably want it to.
Don't be afraid to use white or just-barely-blue-but-mostly-white light. Both of these would look good as any kind of fluorescent lighting that you might feel like incorporating.

I like to look at detailing rooms in a very logical way. For example, if you were to have pipes running across the ceiling, then think about what their purpose is for. Not in terms of 'it puts detail in the room', but rather 'these are pipes for channelling exhaust water from the machinery in the connecting room'. Once you've established a purpose for it, you can also look at whether or not its placement makes sense. Again, to use the pipe example: 'do these pipes logically flow on from that machinery in the connecting room and do they end correctly?'.

This doesn't mean that you need to limit your creativity, it just means your creativity needs to make sense, given what you're designing.

Looking at your screenshot, a few things stand out:

1. Why are the diagonal cross-beams so close to the wall? Support beams are generally there to support weak areas of a structure: are you saying that the weakest part of the structure is the rather large, solid brick wall? To me, if this were a poorly designed building, the beams would be further away from the structural safety of the walls.

2. There are a fair few electrical cables heading towards the large pipe in the ceiling: what are they for?

3. Similarly, there's a fair few large capacitor things hanging on the wall: what are they powering? Why are there so many?

4. The three spotlights: what are they illuminating? If they're lighting up the computer panels, wouldn't it make more sense if they were directly above the computers? If a person stands in front of the computer, they block the light from those beams, making it useless.

5. What are the posts for? The times I've seen posts spread out like that is simply to prevent vehicles from entering an area. If they're to prevent people from passing, then they need some kind of chain between each posts, but in an area such as this, it would seem out of place.

Please don't think of this as me bagging out your screenshot: there's potential there, but you need to sit back and have a good think about it.

Agree

Oh for the love of God. I'm going to say this as calmly as I can.

Never EVER use yellow lighting. It is vile in Goldsource and Source alike.

Nice to see that Ant details his levels in the same way I do. Everything has a story, and a purpose.

I think every talented level designer follows a similar logic. Can't say I'm one to map any more though.

Thank you very much for the suggestions guys, I will take them into consideration. Though remember, this is a WIP thread. That's a screenshot of something not finished yet.

Explanations now.

What are the posts for? The times I've seen posts spread out like that is simply to prevent vehicles from entering an area

Exactly.

All those electrical things, capacitors, pipes(there is some red pulsing light near the pipes in the middle but you can't see them) are supposed to power up the lift. Which, in HL2 terms, is simply huge.

I am sorry I will say this but I have to use yellowish light. I am adding variety yes, but I want a nice warm athmosphere there to give the player a "safe" feeeling. Also, the light beams are there but the light isn't, you think? No, it's just that "200" is not enough intensity, and I have to make it a bit brighter.

The problem is that I don't want to show you all. After all, a good impression is a first impression, and that first impression I want to come from the map itself not from screenshots although I can't resist posting wip screens here :D. Trust me, that chamber actually feels and looks a lot better than in the screenshot :P.

I am also trying to use some custom textures. I've read a thread on Facepunch and saw that many players would like less "default gmod" looking. I am currently using a custom grass texture(was hard to make). Since making my own textures is a bit time consuming and I am not a texture artist, can you guys recommend me some resources like this? Are there any sites that host vtf. quality textures, possibly high res?

One more note. This is a gmod map. Gmod maps aren't supposed to be detailed, but this is one of the areas that are of central interest, so I do accept all of your comments, as it will be more detailed.

I am sorry I will say this but I have to use yellowish light.

No. Seriously, no. That doesn't convey safety, that conveys illness. It's not a warming yellow, it's a rotten yellow - the sort of yellow used in l4d or Ravenholm. Use brightness, not hue to convey safety. Bulbs aren't yellow. They're orange or blue, to varying degrees of saturation. Never yellow.

I am sorry I will say this but I have to use yellowish light. I am adding variety yes, but I want a nice warm athmosphere there to give the player a "safe" feeeling.

I get what you're going for there, but strong yellow lighting doesn't really convey that very well. It's more sickly and uncomfortable. Go for light orange, creamy or beige colours, and faint Earthy greens.

I'd also get another colour in there. If you want the player to feel comfortable you should use colours that are harmonious, that work together nicely.

Super Daylight: 28% better than regular daylight.