Competition 35: Vanilla Half-Life Created 11 months ago2018-08-13 10:28:15 UTC by Penguinboy Penguinboy

Created 11 months ago2018-08-13 10:28:15 UTC by Penguinboy Penguinboy

Posted 11 months ago2018-08-17 14:53:28 UTC Post #340582
SSB, it was just a joke about how the competition is being as close to half-life / vanilla as possible, so the joke was that to be vanilla / original, they would use the outdated and dysfunctional original compile tools and worldcraft. It's nothing to get up in the air about.

Think I've got the plan for my map already in my head. Just to confirm, it's meant to look as if it's part of Black Mesa, but not necessarily something we've seen before or include recognisable areas, right?
Instant Mix Instant MixTitle commitment issues
Posted 11 months ago2018-08-17 15:50:25 UTC Post #340583
@Instant Mix thanks for explanation!

Now you understand what do I say about who jokes... Thanks!
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-18 19:19:13 UTC Post #340597
For someone who wants to participate but doesn't have any ideas, I would have tried to imagine what was behind the broken elevator you see just after entering C3A1. You know, it has a loading point inside but leads to nowhere.
Funny that you mention this, last year, Don (Unq) over at Run Think Shoot Live hosted a Half-Life anniversary live-stream in which he played through Half-Life in one sitting. It was me who suggested taking a look what's behind those elevator doors: There's a func_button that targets an info_landmark referencing a non-existing bsp file. Great trivia.
The Mad Carrot The Mad CarrotMad Carrot
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-18 20:23:54 UTC Post #340599
Funny thing is, I had an idea for a hldm map just a day before the competition. Guess I'll make two versions of the map, and maybe finish some of my old projects before moving on with the mod.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-19 02:06:16 UTC Post #340600
Judging will be based on how well your design matches the original game in addition to the standard measures such as lighting, architecture, ambience and texturing.
This is confusing me. Is this saying we should... 'mimic' Valve's sloppy style of mapping? By sloppy I mean:
  • Limited usage of fancy angled surfaces, rounded corners and precision vertex manipulation
  • For lighting, create a block, put light texture, don't bother scaling and/or shifting the texture
  • Even worse, don't even bother with texturelights, just point lights only
  • Forget to align textures on some faces
  • To connect two area together, built a square corridor with barely any detail work
  • No more than a 5 faces cylinder primitive brush
Stuff like that, Half-Life's official maps are full of such examples of sloppiness.
Is this what we will be judged on, or can we go all out with insane high levels of detail, spend hours vertex manipulating that perfect cliff wall, support pillar, computer terminal as well as spend days getting that perfect lighting going?
The Mad Carrot The Mad CarrotMad Carrot
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-19 04:07:24 UTC Post #340601
My approach is to try and make it fit in with Black Mesa, but I'm not going to skimp on detailing and making things look good. Basic architecture is acceptable for this challenge, and I may end up with a lot of that, but that's really not what I intend to build these days.

I'm not entering this challenge to go for the prizes, it's a great chance to get back into mapping and work simultaneously with the community on a project together. I'm in this to build and release a map that I'm proud of and that hopefully people will enjoy playing.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-19 04:51:29 UTC Post #340602
@Carrot: The restriction is on design - it should look like part of the Black Mesa complex (or Xen). The architecture/lighting/etc judging will be based on the quality of them in your entry, unrelated to how similar they are to HL1. The overall design is what matters, we're not looking for you to replicate the mapping techniques of HL1.
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-21 13:09:50 UTC Post #340620
@Unq: Hear, hear!

I'm just doing this to try and get the creative juices flowing. I'm trying to get out of my habit of creating really corridors that lead to more corridors. Something I openly criticise mods like Azure Sheep for, when all I do is the same thing with more detail... (FYI, The Core is going to suck, and this is why :P )

I'm going to use this challenge to try and break old habits. Interesting combat sections and more variation in game play.
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-21 22:43:41 UTC Post #340624
@Urby have you tried doing a really shit / rough plan on either paper or blocked our in Hammer before mapping proper? I'm very guilty of exactly what you've said, corridors upon corridors and not really thinking about how it goes together and the purpose for this. Could help potentially!
Instant Mix Instant MixTitle commitment issues
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-22 13:38:43 UTC Post #340631
Yeah, I've planned out my corridors on paper before... :\
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-22 18:54:12 UTC Post #340637
I really find this image from Robert Yang useful to reference. It's not perfect but it gives a solid idea of the direction I want to be going in with map layouts.
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Posted 10 months ago2018-08-24 17:15:58 UTC Post #340648
I'll add that with the "advanced" method, you can note that they used walls for interior of areas on multiple sides. I've seen this used professionally like by Hondo for his map endlrainsh "endless rain scientist hunt" for his old scientist hunt mod. This method is typical in actual architecture and can create awesome environments.

At the end of the day, it all depends on the mod/ type of gameplay. Beginner was somewhat used for maps like fy_iceworld and it has consumed thousands of hours of gameplay. Intermediate is great for maps with harder clash points to overcome.

Layout theory ultimately depends on how the map will be played and enjoyed.

cs_assualt although does not have long corridors might suggest similar gameplay to intermediate layout in this example. The clash points are friggin impossible...
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-24 19:42:14 UTC Post #340649
Anyone could attempt to map the ‘expert’ design and see what could be learned from it.

Edit: anyone but me. Don’t even ask. I have like 6 projects and 2 birthday presents to do.
Rimrook RimrookGoldsource Guru
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-25 20:38:25 UTC Post #340676
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UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-27 10:05:46 UTC Post #340688
Very nice UrbanNebula, not only does the architecture looks great but the lighting is spot on.

As for my map, I haven't drawn a layout yet but I will challenge myself in one of the most impossible problems that exists in video game history: making a fun water sequence in an FPS. Of course, I'm not making a water level but I will try to make a water sequence less of a nuisance/obstacle but more of a challenge that has "platforming" to it.

The keyword to this water sequence is "Delta P".
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-27 12:58:47 UTC Post #340691
Looking good, folks!
satchmo satchmoWhat you can do today should have been done yesterday.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-27 13:50:13 UTC Post #340693
Do you map with texture filtering disabled, Urby?
I've just disabled it myself and found that it actually helps aligning things more accurately because of the sharp edges of each individual pixel.
The Mad Carrot The Mad CarrotMad Carrot
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-27 20:05:11 UTC Post #340698
@UrbaNebula
Sexy looks excellent wow job. Pl,ease optimize with vhlt better than bad qhlt ( very old compilers of Half-Life tools ) Bye QHLT, Welcome VHLT. I feel that we play in game like we see realistic lights and shadows.

@savvaisnotagirl
Very nice UrbanNebula, not only does the architecture looks great but the lighting is spot on.
lighting is spot - he need optimize that light_surface ->texture name + bright + color of light and classname in game = light or light_spot than it makes realistic

I think I need to prepare excellent lighting explanations for beginners and advanced mappers
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-27 21:37:55 UTC Post #340699
looool @SourceSkyBoxer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-27 21:54:43 UTC Post #340700
How do I favorite a post
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 00:26:04 UTC Post #340701
What on earth was any of that post meant to mean? I'm pretty sure Urby is using VHLT and also knows how to use texlights
Instant Mix Instant MixTitle commitment issues
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 01:38:06 UTC Post #340702
I think I need to prepare excellent lighting explanations for beginners and advanced mappers
You absolutely should.
Jessie JessieLadytype
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 13:25:24 UTC Post #340711
@savva: Thanks, I'm having a lot of fun with the lighting in this one

@Carrot: I do as a matter of fact. If I could, I would also force people to PLAY with filtering disabled!

@SSB: Thank you, I'm quite aware of VHLT and I use texture lighting (lights.rad) exclusively, except in specific areas where I want more control.
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UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 16:15:51 UTC Post #340713
@UrbaNebula You must've developed a decent work flow if you're able to pull of these in such a short amount of time. Wish I'd have that...

Because meanwhile I'm sitting here with this:
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torekk torekkProcrastinator of the Year
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 18:17:52 UTC Post #340715
@UrbaNebula you are welcome. Nice maps of you are better than me :o

@torekk nice job!

Who can create replacement of subway? ( c0a0 to c0a0d ) ?
And large rail of top and how do we draw like awesome rock ( c0a0b )
Because we would like to improve for celebration of anniversary.

And who have ideas for xeno last end of Half-Life....
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 20:08:23 UTC Post #340719
SourceSkyBoxer said:how do we draw like awesome rock
If you want to draw awesome rocks, you can read my tutorial which is now available on TWHL. :)
Admer456 Admer456Lean, mean, mapping machine :3
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 20:55:52 UTC Post #340720
@torekk: That's looking good. The only thing I would say is that the lighting is a little monotone. One thing I've done in my areas is to put different coloured lights up in the ceilings. Even just a teeny tiny red light occasionally up near the vents would add a lot to those hallways. :D
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 21:13:44 UTC Post #340722
@SSB: I realize the language barrier might not help this point get across, but;

keep in mind that the competition is to create an original area, not a replacement of an existing area.
Jessie JessieLadytype
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-28 23:05:55 UTC Post #340726
Ok @Jessie I understand you now. Thanks! I need continue my work now.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-29 13:30:41 UTC Post #340732
I'm really trying to keep the game play varied and interesting, rather than running from hallways to rooms and killing bads.

I'm also getting increasingly frustrated with glass and water rendering in darkened rooms... Limitation of then engine I know, but it's quite distracting in places. Gonna have to figure out a way to make it look natural.
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-29 14:41:50 UTC Post #340735
Urby said:I'm also getting increasingly frustrated with glass and water rendering in darkened rooms... Limitation of then engine I know, but it's quite distracting in places. Gonna have to figure out a way to make it look natural.
VHLT has an "embed lightmap" feature that bakes the lightmap into the texture for transparent objects. It instead looks a bit wonky when the player shines the flashlight on it, but it's a calculated tradeoff you have to do.
Dr. Orange Dr. OrangeBoth a fruit and a color
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-29 17:38:03 UTC Post #340736
@Urby, I think textures beginning with ! emit light. So, just make your water texture not start with ! and create a brush over the water area and make it a func_water entity. You could use a func_conveyor and make a nice scrolling water texture to add some movement to it or do something else like an animated texture.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-29 22:47:01 UTC Post #340739
zhlt_embedlightmap, it works on some entities depending on the render mode. It's a neat thing. Even works on water, but make sure to put a bigger zhlt_embedlightmapresolution (I think) otherwise it'll take some more time and AllocBlock.
And weren't the ~ textures the ones that emit light?
Admer456 Admer456Lean, mean, mapping machine :3
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-30 01:19:16 UTC Post #340740
Yes the light textures had ~ in the name. But that's just for convenience, texture lighting is totally controlled by lights.rad, or info_texlights, or light_surface, whichever you prefer.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-30 13:44:44 UTC Post #340742
I have always used lights.rad for the sake of consistency. I use info_textlights to get the values right and then when I'm happy I add the value to lights.rad :P

That's only when making custom light textures of course.
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-30 17:25:59 UTC Post #340743
I guess I could post some Work in Progress screenshots of some of my less Work in Progress areas here.
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Dr. Orange Dr. OrangeBoth a fruit and a color
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-30 18:07:46 UTC Post #340744
Yeah I only recently switched to info_texlights. It's nice cause the settings are embedded in the rmf rather than being a separate rad file to keep track of and distribute. LIght_surface is even better though, I'm going to that as soon as I start actually mapping for this.
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-30 19:11:08 UTC Post #340746
@Dr.Orange: Very nice! Definite Office Complex vibes from those screenshots.
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-30 21:05:49 UTC Post #340747
This looks like it'll be a tough competition... some solid entries coming together. Might have to have a shot at it.
Moaby MoabyMk. III
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 00:08:12 UTC Post #340749
Here's a work in progress video.

https://youtu.be/6Hdz35a7HN8
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 00:55:47 UTC Post #340750
I'm really loving what I'm seeing of the WIPs so far, they're all great! There's a good variety of the different HL chapters so far too, which is exactly what I was hoping for :D
Penguinboy PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 09:08:50 UTC Post #340751
@DocRock wow - Nice idea... I have to make as work in process with end of xeno world

c4a3

I add more feature falling rocks from xeno celling if big monster dies since 3 yellow crystals than it will flies thought celling and big room will fill up dirty water and another room will real rock forms ( before cubic - after curvy or weaving )
start big roomstart big room
big room with monster gunbig room with monster gun
high jumping roomhigh jumping room
flying platform with rotatingflying platform with rotating
( PS: It is hard to play with rotating sphere-like platform. )
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 13:05:25 UTC Post #340752
I'm loving the amount of people who are working on this. Creates a real buzz seeing other people's WIPs and I can't wait to run through them. :D

@DocRock: That is awesome!
UrbaNebula UrbaNebulaGoldSourcerer
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 16:39:01 UTC Post #340753
Just posting to tell my idea for the competition.

I plan on making a runway with a couple of hangars, planes, and a control tower.
That's about as far as I've gotten in terms of ideas.
NovaDelta NovaDeltainfo_player_novadelta
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 22:11:24 UTC Post #340757
I'm having a hard time thinking of something good.

I have a funny idea. But i'm not sure how appreciated it will be.

If i can't think of anything before next month, i just might go with that. haha
Tetsu0 Tetsu0Original Cowboy
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 22:34:30 UTC Post #340758
I think I got a prefab addiction...
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Mostly taken from the original half life 1 maps that I decompiled with WinBSPC, yes I know that creates some funky brushwork at times, where it did I either used the vertex manipulation tool to get them back on grid or just re-created it from scratch using the decompiled brushwork as a guide, e.g. I did this for the fan.

Besides the crates, those were actually the things I created first and then thought "hey wait, why re-invent the wheel?" and went on a hunt, might release this as a prefab pack as well afterwards for everyone to use.

Also still missing a lot of things, but I always loose track of which decompiled maps I already checked for useful things, and there's so many...
torekk torekkProcrastinator of the Year
Posted 10 months ago2018-08-31 23:21:45 UTC Post #340759
I always wondered why Valve didn't release more of their prefabs, like the vehicles. There's no way they actually had every level designer make a new SUV or Tank from scratch every time they wanted to use one.
JeffMOD JeffMODCall 141.12
Posted 10 months ago2018-09-01 00:30:52 UTC Post #340760
Thanks SourceSkyBoxer and UrbaNebula :)
Posted 10 months ago2018-09-01 12:17:53 UTC Post #340761
@torekk Yeah you hava saved finished prefabs for Half-Life :) Good idea.

But how do we have to merge to maps if we are using Jack-Hammer. Please make sure clean and copy and past to map!

Can we have simple prefabs for jmf or rmf than we copy and past from prefabs to our map?

@JeffMOD Because Valve Software doesn't care to mappers. I am so surprised and we feel mad to Valve Software because Valve Software wastes for bad development. Like they are sometimes giving up. I see very commonly.

@DocRock you are welcome :D
Posted 10 months ago2018-09-01 12:47:40 UTC Post #340762
@SourceSkyBoxer They aren't really prefabs as in .ol files, just a prefabs.rmf with all the brushes. Mostly func_detailed, but I kept some as func_breakable.

That's as far as prefabs go for JACK Hammer, since the prefab factory doesn't work there.
torekk torekkProcrastinator of the Year
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