Comments

Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 18:37:33 UTC in vault item: dm_lars Comment #11275
Some great constructive criticisms! They're hard to swallow at first, but all of your advice makes perfect sense to me.

I was definitely focusing too much on the theme and gimmicks, than the fundamental, most important part of a map--the layout!

How valuble an unbiased opinion is! No one wants to admit that there masterpiece has any flaws whatsoever... but now I can move forward with new ideas :)

Thank you Captain P!
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 15:47:52 UTC in vault item: sol_arena Comment #11274
Can't remember that map in UT actually..

Anyway, this map is pretty nice.
I'm not going to rate, because I do find this map a bit unfinished.
By the way, in the red room, I could jump out of the window.
Like Ant said, clip the windows!

I simply love the lightning, could you please tell me how you did those fuzzy funky lights? The ones seen in the screenshot on the ceiling.
Are those sprites or something??

This map needs a bit more weapons by the way.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 15:35:28 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11273
I'll keep it short, simply because I agree with salty on most parts.

This map is seriously, not suited for hldm.
The map is to small and cramped, textures & lightning are horrible!
Also, ammo and a gun at the same place? No, that just looks ugly.

I like the convoyer thought, they are allways fun. :)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 14:53:23 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11272
well, if anyone could make that red texture i used into a blue shaded one then it would look better, as for the boxes...being black thats y i put all thoes light entities in there, trying to fix it, if anyone knows what the problem could be let me know.

as for thet columbs, thats what they look like in halo
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 14:02:11 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11271
Saltycrap you nitwit don't give him bullshit...Although G-kid I hope you haven't forgot about the comment on my map ;)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 12:25:24 UTC in vault item: dm_lars Comment #11270
From my PM to Rowley (beware, long post):

Hey rowley,

I've taken a run down the map now. smile - :)

Well, first of all, it's a nice theme to go with and despite using HL textures, you pulled the theme off nicely. Congrats for that. I really liked the R2D2 health chargers and the nice style of those houses.
Obviously there's the over-stretched texture problem (it's just too much) and the somewhat simple lighting, but hey.

But, let's go directly to what I think is a big problem: the layout. The top is basically a kilbox++ (++ for the cover wink-wink - ;)), the lower part is an extended killbox (extended because there are some doors, all leading to the same half-circular path around the centre). With some more height difference and some better connections, I can see the lower part become something interesting, sort of an arena styled thing. The upper part... despite it's funny gimmicks, doesn't really lead anywhere.
There's another thing and that's the moveability. The narrow corridors hindered movement a lot - you may want to keep that in mind next time.

You already said in the maps comments that you were running out of resources. May I suggest trying some layouts first? Just some bare-bone crete-textured layout levels? It's the approach I've taken for my current HL2DM map dm_mudanchee, and I found the first 2 or 3 layouts to be quite worthless. Only after some playing I found a tight, well-flowing one that I later tweaked after playtests. Right now the map isn't finished yet, but the gameplay already stands and it's easy for me to spread detail across the map evenly and this approach also allows me to see where I can still put in details and where not.
The creation of Detention went actually very similar, although I believe that's more luck than wisdom. The first few attempts resulted in a meagre, all-too-similar looking and hard-to-navigate map. The final outcome, despite some flaws, plays well (looks a bit so-so but hey smile - :)).
So instead of letting your resources run out after detailing the crap out of your map, spend them first on the core gameplay, then use the rest for details (which often should be sufficient to get a nice map if you planned it right).
Your map actually reminds me of Sector Gamma. The fine-looking Chernobyl reactor level I once was working on. It looked fine and detailed and I've put a load of work into it, but in the end I got stuck on an unworkable layout, with way too few connections between the (badly planned) combat area's. A real shame - a proper planning would've saved the map. Luckily the textures served me well for The Playtest. smile - :)

So basically, I recommend starting fresh with a new layout. This map could then serve as a theme test map, something that gets you in the right style and mood and where you can pick elements from to put into the final map.
This is often an uneasy choice, but believe me - the result will be so much better and you'll be happy you did it.

A little more on layouts: I've learned a drawing method from a German Unreal article that lets you draw the core structure of a map very easily. It's basically drawing each combat area as a circle, and each connection between such area's as a line. Run through some good playing maps and try to make some schedules of them like that. Often, a map has about 2-4 main combat area's, with each area having at least 3 connections to other ones. Most connections only cover small distances, often no more than 2-4 seconds running. Longer connections usually aren't straight, or provide more cover or dodge possibilities.
Then there's the cover - some area's provide great cover against some entrances while being vulnerable to others, some entrances put you out in the open while others allow you to take cover quickly.
There's also height differences and their effect - the lower player should be given some advantage against the natural cover advantage of the higher player.
Also, think about warning signals and traps. In Unreal, the flashing sound of someone picking up a health vial told the experienced player someone was coming up around the corner. A shallow pool of water serves the same purpose. There's also the broadcasting version - when someone gets the RPG the sirens go off, for example.

More of a rant about planning, layouts and gameplay mechanics than about your map, but I think you can benefit from such an approach (and from the stuff I learned from that article wink-wink - ;)). The theme is fine, the layout is weak.

Good luck revamping this one and may the force be with you! wink-wink - ;)
Captain P
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 12:14:57 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11269
re DL-ing :(
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 12:06:45 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11268
fixed it
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 11:13:42 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11266
k, thanks all. i will start working now, but i have to leave for rugby soon.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 10:17:14 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11265
Should be an Instant Classic.

DL-ing!
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 09:07:09 UTC in vault item: Star Wars (map a movie) Comment #11264
Yeah, I noticed that after I noclipped out to have a look around (amazing that I still remember all this, it was over 2 years ago that I had a look).
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 08:27:00 UTC in vault item: sol_arena Comment #11263
Woops, thought that the holes were small enough to keep you inside....I'll check it. (btw I usually don't try to jump out of windows:))
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 08:26:54 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11262
I was playing this map with Hunter yesterday, and we noticed a strange bugglitch in your map. At first i thought that was a result og fast vis compiling.

There are some spots in your map with somekind of strange invisible wall. Its not really a wall, but more like an invisible obstacle. You can still walk through it, but it feel like having somekind of lag. Can't really explain it.

Hunter?
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 07:32:54 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11261
The screenshot (I can't play it here at school, too) shows only a dead-end corner that's badly lit. I'd say, take a screenshot that gives a better overview and shows a more interesting part of your map. Reminds me, there should be a book written about the Art of Screenshots. ;)

I'll check the maps once I'm at home.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 06:39:47 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11260
thanks G_KID thats something i can use. I will try when i come home. im in school now :(
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 06:34:18 UTC in vault item: Tau_Map Comment #11259
Ok, you got me convinced.

/me adds map to server.
This comment was made on an article that has been deleted.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 04:13:16 UTC in vault item: Slomo/Filter Example Comment #11257
Hot DAMN that was awsome. I'm stille trying to figure out how in sam hell you did this, i cant wait to use it.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 03:48:20 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11256
+simple layout, kinda like it.
+texture usage.
+Well lit
+CS Cameo

=Size or scale of the map.

-doors, but there alright.

****'s
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 03:47:58 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11255
Shouldn't this be a deathmatch map?
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 03:05:35 UTC in vault item: UrbanWaste Comment #11254
The bricks.... That came down to me not wanting to get custom textures because I hate the HL ones.
Things in progress:
  • More Trims (School side of road)
  • Rotate / Re-align textures on Fallen Bricks.
  • Better Sky Transition
  • Modify Scrolling Water
  • Kill Ambient sound that plays everywhere. Stick in Ambients in Certain places. (Power Boxes, Water, Vents on roof)
  • IM KEEPING THE CRATES (unless they really are that bad)
  • Other... Stuff.

Thanks for the imput Jax
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 02:56:58 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11253
damnit. links didnt work
@ Admin: can u fix them??
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 02:56:04 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11252
Overall. I dont see why This didnt win. COUGHRimrookCOUGH.
I love the map. Good things Bad Things. I agree that it is much too mazelike.
If you dont have enough people playing i can see how this can get very boring very fast.
NO egon ;(
I like the level edges. Very smoothly put together, except these 2:
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/tetsuosho/dm_breach0000.jpg
and
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/tetsuosho/dm_breach0001.jpg
You can see The glass. Might wanna Null That. And the cracks in the rock caught my eye in the first place.
Minus 1.5 points.
Other places:
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/tetsuosho/dm_breach0002.jpg
Such as the Gauss trap. I like. Adds danger as well as to the open... ness of having to put your back to 2 flanks in order to get the gun. PLUS the laser.
5 points.
You took an idea from my map. Completley un intentional but oh well
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/tetsuosho/dm_breach0003.jpg
-2 points.
Amazing Detail on the FLOOR of all places. I love it. My jaw dropped XD
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/tetsuosho/dm_breach0004.jpg
+11 points
Love the Vending machines, Love the Room transition. Love the lighting .. ceiling.. hornet launcher...
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/tetsuosho/dm_breach0005.jpg
+4 points
Point total : whocares, you get 5 stars.

Our forums do not support HTML. The forums support BBCode, and the map vault supports nothing. By the way, you may want to learn XHTML. ;) - Ant
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 02:50:58 UTC in vault item: UrbanWaste Comment #11251
Ok, just had a run through and took some notes...

- Texture alignment needed on many brushes
+/- I see you added trims like Rimrook pointed out but a few brushes still need them
+ Roofs!
+ Neat vents on roof
- Continuous annoying sound
- Argh! Too many blue crates inside
- The underground scrolling water texture just doesnt look right (I realise this is a complicated thing to pull off)
+ Basketball hoop
- Skybox issue
+ Nice entity setup for the lift
- Overused brick texture
- Sky doesnt really suit the lighting/lighting doesnt suit the sky
- Like Rimrook said, you should really rotate the bricks that have 'fallen' from the wall, they wouldnt all fall in a line like that.

Overall: A nice DM map with some sparks of idea but is still too bland.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 02:09:48 UTC in vault item: UrbanWaste Comment #11250
Hmm Couldn't open ty.wad..

Did you forget to add something after the update?
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-16 00:38:28 UTC in vault item: Halo 2 Elongation Comment #11249
and the gravity is lowered to give a more halo like feel, i added the assult rifle model to the zip file too
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 22:28:28 UTC in vault item: sol_arena Comment #11248
Clip the windows by the way, I took a, ahem, "leap of faith" straight out of them. :P

And yeah, it was extremly hard to judge.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 22:14:20 UTC in vault item: Hotel_unfinished Comment #11247
Thats a really cool map.. but i think it need some more space.. :)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 19:36:33 UTC in vault item: Tau_Map Comment #11246
Argh I just tried that map, and I love the idea of it! I spend a great deal of time on it and still couldn't get past the 3rd obstacle! (would be nicer too if you didn't have to backtrack for power packs too)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 19:09:14 UTC in vault item: sol_arena Comment #11245
Some really nice stuff! I'm glad I didn't have the job of juror on this compo, because it must have been very tough!

Beautifully constructed/textured/lit rooms, and quite imposing/scary imo. I can't stress that enought, the rooms looked really great! I think my fav was the one with the red lighting.

Layout is a bit comlex, but it works because it's so small. Kudos to you for how you interwove the floors together.

Use of different color lighting and sprites looked really good.

Now the complaints... The lifts were a bit of a distraction, as I kept fallin to my death! Maybe an up/down lift right next to each other might do the trick?

The three light rays or whatever kind of rays looked neat, but I think they might look better a bit more transparent. Still looked really cool though.

Weapons: Not enough of them imo, but not a huge deal.

All in all great work and a great contender.

Great work!
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 17:37:31 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11244
I'd take away those teasings - they disappoint and confuse. :)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 17:36:55 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11243
thius would be worthy of 2nd place if it didn't have so many silly bugs.. 2 more days work on this might have seen you with gold..
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 17:35:46 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11242
SaltyCrack, you absolute tool.
He jsut asked for some useful comments, what do you come out with? Crap.
I was just about to test it, but realised it is for CS.

But I can give you some pointers regardless of not having played.
*Work on creating inspiring and imaginative architecture.
*Texturing needs to be varied and try to fit a suitable theme.
*The layout needs to be developed on paper until you have worked out something that is fair for both sides, and working out where choke points are etc.

If you nail those 3 your map will be great. :]
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 17:14:39 UTC in vault item: sol_arena Comment #11241
I loved DM-Tempest so I will definitely test it when I get the chance.
Screenie looks nice btw.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 17:02:44 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11240
Thanks for the comments, keep 'em coming!

Muzzle: Thankyou, Ill come in for a game when I have some spare time.

rowleybob: Most of the inaccessible things you can't get to, and are just to tease you :)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 15:03:14 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11239
If your mentioning poor w_polys, it's usually helpful to say how high they were, and exactly where/post a screenie.

The outside areas you're refering to--unless you become more specific--, I think was in the 600-800 range, which is not even remotely high :|

I forgot to ask, is there a way to get the egon gun, or some of the other seemingly inaccessible goodies?
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 14:41:31 UTC in vault item: Spawning Stuff Comment #11238
Ow hush you, you don't even have source..
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 14:28:38 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11237
Really nicely done and it's easy to see why this map won a medal ;)

+unprecedented amount of detail work for a dm_map
+Good performance--I only noticed the wpolys going above 1000 once...
+Great vistas--terrain outside the office-style windows, laser room, etc.
+superb, interesting architecture throughout--hallways, stairs, railings--all very well done.
+fresh textures! A new keyboard texture!--and many more through this map :)
+neat layout with varied relief, and ceiling heights--refreshing!

-severely lacking in ambience--pretty much dead silence throuhout the level...Add some!
-Layout is right on the cusp of being too big. You might consider truncated it a bit, but most certainly I wouldn't make it any bigger!

All in all, subperb work!

Great job and congratulations!
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 14:22:18 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11236
saltycrak, please say why it looks like crap? And how can i make it better?
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 14:20:10 UTC in vault item: SmallHall Mappack Comment #11235
shiny blade.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 11:25:38 UTC in vault item: UrbanWaste Comment #11234
From the notes I made while running through this one (additional info is added between <>):

1. readme.txt...

<Many compo entries lacked here, they either had a readme.txt or nothing at all. Use mapname.txt instead so your info isn't overwritten with each new map that uses a readme.txt>

2. Turn off the annoying sound! Subtility, please! Well, at least it isn't forgotten...

3. Looks fair enough to go with, but not really astoundishing. Note the ugly shadows and the inivisble barriers, plus some fairly simple buildings.<br>
<Rimrook pointed out some of the smaller detail thingies that could've been done better. I'd like to point at the overall design - it's probably too large and open to put in too much detail, but anyway, you should put some time on that before putting a lot of time on the smaller things. Otherwise you may well find yourself wasting time on details your map can't support, or doesn't need in the end just because you neglected larger things>

4. Don't know if this will play well, but play it will. Everything takes place in almost the same area, and that's probably a good thing... Nice use of height combat.

<It's sort of an arena-styled map. Could be good fun, but I think you may want to spend some more time on map layout and design.>

5. Gameflow stings a bit though. Some ladders and area's are needlessly hard to get to. Almost as if this map is trying to keep me away from the fun.

<Take that machine that puts you up on the roof for example - it's very very slow and cumbersome to use. Personally I like a map that encourages fast movement and allows players to take some cover now and then.
That's where planning comes in too - you wasted an hour on a cool-working machine that finally didn't improve the gameplay...>

Conclusion: Overall, a meagre map, but it'll probably play nice, due to it's one single arena-style, and the height differences.

Good luck improving this. :)

@Rimrook: Changed your 'links' to links. It's possible to use html here afaik. :)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 11:11:32 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11233
From the comments I made while taking a run through it (I added some stuff between <> for better explanation to you):

1. readme.txt ain't gonna get into my folders, thankyou.
<there were many maps that had either a readme.txt or none at all, instead of a mapname.txt.>

2. Good first impression. Solid theme and style (with the exception of the CS part).
<The CS part, though a funny touch, broke the theme a bit for me, and it was just a small single room with only two paths leading to it - pretty predictable combat there. About the theme, perhaps linking a testlab to an office isn't really normal... the map feels consistent overall but there are some grips to this.>

3. Some annoying hindrances: the CS players detract, the doors that slide open are slightly obstructing (what purpose do they really serve? what positive?). Some invisible barriers and weapons/charger placed in unreachable area's (a real letdown).
<I remember someone commenting on my map Detention that the broken ladder up on a buildings side really attracted them, but when they gauss-jumped up there and found it was just a 'detail', they were disappointed.>

4. Lack of height. However, looks like a fair layout.
<I would really add some more play-levels to this if I were you. The map feels 'low', too.>

5. Lacks ambient sound - the electric crackle is overused and gets annoying, while there's a few machines that could do with some sound.
<I assume it's a military surrounding by looking at the ammo crate and weapons outside, so why not add some gun-fire to the background? And some subtle (!) computer sounds and such... taking the electric crackle out or reducing it's volume greatly...>

Conclusion: Nice first impression, but some things just sting a bit. Not as good as could have been.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 10:50:59 UTC in vault item: Operation Overlord Comment #11232
I'm rating this up for great justice!
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 09:30:53 UTC in vault item: Star Wars (map a movie) Comment #11231
when you mess with perspective that much to achieve that kind of scale its hard to do much more than I did, I prefer the first part myself too despite spending so much longer on the second.

For reference the tie fighter you start in is bigger than the frigates that appear and takes up a good portion of the size of the super star destroyer!
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 09:16:23 UTC in vault item: Star Wars (map a movie) Comment #11230
Yeah, what a hunk of shit.

Seriously though, since I haven't commented, I might as well do so now: extremly well done and executed map which really does capture the essence of Star Wars. I felt the action was a little too far away in the second map, but it was still quite good. A well deserved five stars.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 08:51:31 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11229
Jax, i've uploaded your map to my HLDM server. Join in so we can have a run on it. :)
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 06:34:16 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11228
I agree. Although it was an extremly solidly built map, there were areas that definately needed improvement (that lap, particularly). Also, you have some brushwork issues with the window/rock bit. I'd check it carefully if I were you.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 04:58:02 UTC in vault item: Catalyst Comment #11227
Its nice can't make that yet :(
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 04:14:49 UTC in vault item: dm_breach Comment #11226
Nice map Jax, Liked it very much, I just didn't like somne of the textures (mainly the decal looking ones)

I'm not very good with doing all the shit and telling you what to change but I'll give you a 4 because it needs a bit more improvement In some areas. And the dead medkit is a bit to thick, I'd say make it a bit smaller.
Commented 18 years ago2006-03-15 03:43:53 UTC in vault item: Reflective Water Comment #11225
this is much better because when you tag on the wall and go underwater it doesnt dissappear hehe.