# Sledge (Hammer Alternative) Alpha Build Created 4 years ago2013-07-27 02:24:39 UTC by Penguinboy

Created 4 years ago2013-07-27 02:24:39 UTC by

Posted 2 years ago2016-02-20 00:52:01 UTC Post #328952
got your game setup locations set properly?
Tetsu0Original Cowboy
Posted 2 years ago2016-02-20 14:47:20 UTC Post #328953
I think so.
By the way, it doesn't launch the game nor does it ask me to run the game.
Posted 2 years ago2016-02-20 19:40:00 UTC Post #328954
I've never checked "steam install" maybe that's the cause.
Tetsu0Original Cowboy
Posted 2 years ago2016-03-22 23:36:59 UTC Post #329520
I have a question. Is there any way to save as an OBJ and keep the texture coords? I would absolutely love a good BSP map editor for use in more modern engines that use 3d model based maps. Its so hard to find a decent way to make BSP style maps. Exporting from Sledge works awesomely but having to redo the UVs and re texture everything is a bummer
Posted 2 years ago2016-03-23 02:51:37 UTC Post #329522
I don't know a lot about the OBJ format, so I'm not sure. It's probably possible, but I've never worked with OBJ textures before.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-03 07:52:35 UTC Post #329641
Hello guys, does sledge editor work with floating point?

I am hopeful because I want know because JackHammer has bug of floating points because after compiler than maybe textures are not visibled or shaped-holes. That is why I want know if sledge 1:1 like Valve Hammer Editor too
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-03 08:16:11 UTC Post #329643
It should! If you find any cases of Sledge producing different results to VHE (plus HLFix or a floating point hack), let me know and I'll try and fix it!
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-04 21:02:20 UTC Post #329665
Oh @Penguinboy, thanks for support!

But I am using JackHammer but JackHammer has problem with floating point because saved map was generated by JackHammer and vhlt compiled too slow because vhlt doesn't know about wrong map format ( just it used only Quake map format because it hasn't reader for floating points.

PS: HLFix doesn't work for me because I am using Windows 7 Pro x64

VHE with hack of floating points yes and 32K yes I have here... from Sven Coop Forum
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 04:53:38 UTC Post #329668
I could never get VLuzacn floating points to work with Sledge.
Error: Not hammer.exe from Valve Editor etc..
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 19:14:17 UTC Post #329677
@Kachito
Hi You know "floating point" need if you draw brush very small and it compiles generating brush like my window of nice hallway. ( Did you see pictures from Show your screenshots from WIP )
For example it is happens without floating points and vhlt builds very slow because map file hasn't recognizable floating points. It means issues of map structure and it looks like Quake Map format and it sees wrong to generate to bsp-file with hidden hole-able shapes. That is why floating point is very important for GoldSource Engine. It is fixing to hidden shapes.
Example for screenshot: Used from JackHammer or Sledge Editor:
Used with valve Hammer Editor with floating points:
That is proof of floating point.
I hope your crab hugs sledge developer
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 20:21:01 UTC Post #329678
Hi SourceSkyBoxer, thanks for showing those examples.
Could you use Jpegs for screenshots, though? 1MB for a 1024 x 768 image is pretty unnecessary.
I know 1MB isn't massive, but I view the site on my phone quite often and it all adds up!
ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 21:26:11 UTC Post #329679
@Archie:
Oh sorry! I will convert to beloved jpeg all screenshots. I never forget that. You're right because I don't know what is big compressed image format. jpeg is smaller than png...
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 21:29:36 UTC Post #329680
ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 22:12:13 UTC Post #329681
I know 1MB isn't massive, but I view the site on my phone quite often and it all adds up!
When you pay 3 euros/month for 5GB of mobile internet those problems cease to exist.
StrikerI seriously doubt myself
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-05 22:12:45 UTC Post #329682
Thanks for the screenshots, can you upload an RMF so I can test it for myself?
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 02:13:39 UTC Post #329685
@Striker:
Mobile data 5 GB pro 3 Euro/Month.

So arrogant!! My mobile data 5 GB from Germany, o2 costs 25 Euro/Month. But it is too expensive to you. You're living in Greek, right?

@Penguinboy:n
Sorry my rmf was after my working progress. Find my http://twhl.info/forums.php?thread=14851&page=last with pictures andmy username! Because I am continued to drawing map and snap many screenshots...
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 02:53:01 UTC Post #329686
That's fine, but without a sample map to reproduce the issue, I wont be able to fix it... can you make a sample map that I can use to compare VHE to Sledge?

Does anyone else know about this issue? I'd like to be able to reproduce it if possible.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 17:18:09 UTC Post #329696
@PenguinBoy,
I send you zip with 3 different version of vhe, jh and se
3 different format:
vhe = Valve Hammer Editor with Floating Point
jh = JackHammer
se = Sledge Editor

PS: jh and se have made by me black hollowed outside-box
And vhe has red holdbox like you want check without leak.
Please do not open rmf just you should open _vhe.map than you see with red hollowed outside-box drawing by Valve Hammer Editor

Please promise me! Do not injury my copy right of my map!

If you're serious and honest than I will make safe. Because I am scared who steals my nice map than somebody hurts my architecture!

Thanks! File was uploaded to private message.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 17:42:01 UTC Post #329697
We employed* Penguinboy as a programmer on our mod The Core. Turns out he was just doing it to get access to our nice map and hurt all the architecture. Don't fall for the same trick, SSB!



*non-monetarily
ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 18:42:37 UTC Post #329698
@Archie:
Oh PenguinBoy is programmer.. Yes I saw because he uses C# good work!

I want believe this because you are good like other real good people. But I don't know that. That is why I will publish sometimes things if you customize your The Core of my great brush architecture - If you decide.

I am working as my own mod. But I don't know what is correct game title of my own mod. I accept to publish my files if you need. Because I appreciate safe with TWHL

Don't worry!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 20:35:47 UTC Post #329700
Haha, don't worry, nobody will steal your work here.
ArchieGoodbye Moonmen
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 23:29:09 UTC Post #329704
Thanks for uploading those files, SSB. I actually couldn't get it looking nicely on any editor I used, see examples:

Sledge: https://i.imgur.com/Npg2id1.png
Jackhammer: https://i.imgur.com/jeOiPAs.png
Hammer (normal): https://i.imgur.com/HHP2m6u.png
Hammer (floating point hack): https://i.imgur.com/WKxUrp8.png

As you can see the normal Hammer is closest (because everything is rounded to the closest grid point) but there are still a few gaps in the geometry. What's your process to get it looking correct?

With all the off-grid geometry it's not hard to see why each editor behaves differently. The MAP format has trouble with off-grid points at the best of times.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-06 23:54:32 UTC Post #329705
Hi @Penguinboy, I have a problem with the sledge, when I put the spirit.fgd file it gave me a error saying:

Unable to parse FGD. Unexpected At On line 1296, character 1.

In hammer and jackhammer doesn't gave me errors so I don't know what's happening, could yo help me? :V
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 00:11:05 UTC Post #329706
Can you post the FGD on dropbox/pastebin? I'm not getting that error on the SOHL 1.8 FGD.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 02:17:34 UTC Post #329707
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 03:07:14 UTC Post #329708
Looks like you've got a badly formatted FGD file. I made some fixes to it, this one will work: http://pastebin.com/raw/3jvcW5dz

The problems were:
Line 1295, an empty class with no brackets, I added [ and ]
Line 1348, the close quote was missing, I added " to fix it

The first problem could potentially be a feature of FGD that Sledge doesn't support, so I'll fix it so it works. But the second issue is definitely a problem in the FGD itself, not Sledge.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 03:12:35 UTC Post #329709
Thanks, it work, keep working on sledge its a very nice program, the only thing it needs its a source suport :V
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 03:25:19 UTC Post #329710
Sledge will support Source just as soon as The Core is released.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 03:33:58 UTC Post #329711
I suspect it may take longer than that >_>
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-07 09:41:19 UTC Post #329712
Hi @Penguinboy correct!

just my mistake because "normal" or "floating-used" hammer. It is okay my process.

Thanks for understanding! I am sorry for my mistake because I don't know because hammer.exe by me I have 2 patchers by Vluzacn and i have applied 2 patchers to hammer. Than hammer still patched and I used it. That is why I am not using floating. I don't know because I already installed Valve Hammer Editor with -/+32768 and fresh. If you like fix normal version of valve hammer editor to Sledge Editor, why not?

Please please give me! I need spirit.fgd for Valve Hammer Editor 3.5.3 because fgd doesn't show models... How do I fix it?

Thanks

@DiscoStu , really you want The Core released than Source Engine moves to SLedge Editor? Wow Nice to listen! I hope Sledge Editor wins again JackHammer. I would like to support Sledge Editor because it is good and has built-in universal patch compiler.

// Edit:
I have big idea for sledge:
Fix normal points like normal valve hammer 3.5.x
Sphere and trows should to get 2 triangles like my map curved brushwork and do not use cube-like brush from Source Engine. You know I created trows-like tunnel for subways from Sven Coop Forum I think post from 2012 - 2014.

That is why sphere and trows need many triangles better than cube-like brushwork.

And we would like to add function choose for aurora if you use spirit of half life than sledge will visible a built-in button ... Like models and sprite and creator for detail textures and manage with own was if you have customized textures than you just add or update texture to own wad package better than we don't need to use wally or makewad. Why not?

Import/export supports 3ds format because it is very cleaning better than wavefront obj

If you like my suggestions
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-09 07:33:48 UTC Post #329740
Could someone please confirm that you can only nudge vertices with the arrow keys if you drag-select them (and cannot if you click-select them)? It's kinda annoying.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-09 08:37:14 UTC Post #329742
You're right, what an odd bug. The VM tool is rewritten in the next release, so it shouldn't be an issue, but I'll double check to make sure it's fixed.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 00:30:27 UTC Post #329748
So I can't compile any maps. Sledge doesn't seem to be including any of my .wad files during compile. I have the necessary .wad files in my mod folder and the valve folder. I have set my max texture memory to a huge number. I am not using too many/large textures or too many wads. I have all wad names entered both as "additional wads" and as "whitelisted wads" in the texture section.

Here's a typical HLCSG error log that I get...

[i]
Wadfiles not in use by the map will be excluded

CreateBrush:
(0.00 seconds)
World bounds: (-384 -448 -32) to (224 160 160)
124 map planes
CSGBrush:
(0.01 seconds)
240 csg faces
120 used faces
0 tiny faces
0 tiny clips
Wad files required to run the map: (None)

FindTextures elapsed time = 0ms
qsort(miptex) elapsed time = 0ms

--- END hlcsg ---
[/i]

I can compile my simple test map perfectly fine in Hammer, so the problem is only occurring in Sledge. Am I missing a step somewhere?
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 03:33:11 UTC Post #329750
Hmm, I'd have to see your settings to make sure, but there's a few things you can try. First of all, there's no need to have so many copies of the wads, it's best to remove them from 'additional wads' and only have one copy in your game or mod directory, Sledge will automatically load them from there. Also make sure you're using the VHLT tools because the original HL tools have issues finding the correct files when they all aren't on the same drive.

The compile will set the detected list of wads as a property of your map, you can see it in the 'map properties' dialog. The list should be set to the list of wads that the compile tools will use during compile.
If that list is wrong, then it's likely a problem with Sledge. If the list looks right, it might be an issue with your settings or compile tools. If you can provide more info about your settings and compile tools it would help with finding the issue.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 05:52:36 UTC Post #329751
Sorry, I should have mentioned I'm using Vluzcan's ZHLT. Thanks for the quick reply!

The issue is definitely in the Map Properties! The "wad" value is blank! You mentioned a list of wads and the screenshot makes it look like it's located somewhere in the Half-Life directory. Is this just a text file of some sort or a folder or...?

EDIT: Compiling my map seems to set the "wad" value to blank. Values that I enter in that field stay until I attempt to compile.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 07:34:19 UTC Post #329752
Yep, the setting is auto-set by Sledge every time you compile to the list of wad files that are being used by the map. For some reason, it thinks that no textures are in use.

After a compile it's supposed to look something like: "C:\path\to\halflife.wad; C:\path\to\decals.wad", and so on. Setting it manually won't work because it'll get overwritten every time.

It's a strange one because I don't know how it would happen. Are you using WON or Steam Half-Life? What region/language is your Windows set to? Is Sledge showing the textures correctly when you open the map?
This might be a possible cause, can you see if this helps:

Take a look at the extensions of your wad files - See if the file extension is "WAD" (upper case) or "wad" (lower case). I suspect that Sledge might not work correctly when the extension isn't exactly "wad" in lower case, try renaming them if that's the case.

(Note: In Windows XP you need to rename to something else first or it won't work:

Let me know if this works! If not, it might help if you took a screenshot of the wads in your file explorer so I can see if anything looks strange. Make sure 'hide file extensions' is turned off!
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 08:02:11 UTC Post #329753
Why, hello guys. Peter Brev here, author of a Half-Life mod called Hard Duty.

I installed many Hammer alternatives on my computer and I have a few things to say about Sledge.

I started my mod using VHE. I, then, heard about Sledge and Jackhammer being two alternatives to mapping. I gave both editors a go. Sorry if I offense you, Penguinboy, but I chose Jackhammer over Sledge.

While Sledge is very good and user-friendly, at least for me, I encountered too many problems as it is way too unstable on my computer and crashed each time I either alt+entered, saved the map, pressed apply on the entity's property, and so on... Most of the time, I lost all the development progress and that was very frustrating.

I understand it is an alpha build, but as soon as there is a more stable version, I will gladly give it a new try.

I wish you good luck, though, and keep up the good work,

Peter
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 08:14:26 UTC Post #329754
Thanks for the feedback. When did this happen, and did you submit the bugs when the error happened? It sounds like your particular issues might be caused by something in your FGD so it might be easy to fix.

Of course Sledge shouldn't crash even if your FGD is strange so it needs to be fixed in the program itself. Do you mind sending me a copy of your FGD and a small RMF that is problematic (e.g. one entity or whatever triggers the error) so I can debug the issue?
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 08:41:27 UTC Post #329755
I have sent you the necessary elements in a PM. Have you received them?
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 09:14:18 UTC Post #329758
Yes, thanks. I'll see if they cause any issues for me.

The best way for me to find an issue is through the bug submission system. Did you ever click 'submit bug' when you got an error? If you could let me know what day you did that, I'd be able to find the error detail in the error logs. Or even better, could you open Sledge and try and get the error to happen, and then submit the error details?

Edit: sorry, those FGDs are Jackhammer ones which Sledge doesn't support yet. Can you upload the ones you were using with Sledge? Though if you haven't made any changes to them from the standard HL1 FGD then it might be a different issue entirely.
PenguinboyHaha, I died again!
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 09:43:18 UTC Post #329760
Unfortunately, I did not. I only got that box once, but did not send anything. I shall remember to do it next time. However, most of the time, Sledge just stops responding and I have to kill the process anyway, so I do not get the error report box most of the time.

I will upload the Sledge's FGD I was using in a PM.

Edit: I have sent the FGDs.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 09:55:49 UTC Post #329761
hi @PeterBrev
Please check my screenshots - If Sledge doesn't generate clean map because it has bug since compiling and you see bad in-game.

Hey my dear @penguin, iek iek, How is your fix? sometimes, I have readden your messages. Please fix bug of map version of Valve Hammer Editor. I am hopeful to you. If you find solutions.

Thanks
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 13:55:32 UTC Post #329767
@SSB

Thanks for the taking the time to respond but the problem is entirely different. I am talking about random crashes when performing the same things (see my first post above).
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 17:02:25 UTC Post #329768
@PeterBrev
Yes you know Valve Hammer Editor still is almost best program for Half-Life and Mods ever.

Other like JackHammer and Sledge Editor are bugged to write bad map structure because both apps have "negative" floating points and Valve Hammer Editor hasn't floating points because vhe can write clean x, y, z and scale, texture and entities. Good work. Did you see my screenhots from current page number ( just scroll up and find my posts ) hallway-window picture sees bad because it was written by JackHammer or Sledge Editor. So sadly to other apps you can not be happy if your map structure messed up since writing process and generated bad shapes or holes to in-game.

But Q3Radiant and Valve Hammer Editor are winner again Sledge Editor and JackHammer.

@all I think who want develop map editor like Valve Hammer Editor. It sees not good. So sad because Valve Software is great world champion again Russian and Australian.

That is bad for both countries like this:
For Australia: kangaroos hit with boxing to cowboys - No chance because cowboys have weapons. Peng, peng kangaroos are died.
For Russia: arrogant armies watch hard to cowboys - No chance because our horses trample scats to armies. Cowboys laugh to armies and they vomit since bad smelling of scats by horses.

Who are cowboys? Answer it is Valve Software LLC, from the United States of America.

That is why you should believe me. I am not crazy I want explain only because I feel that Americans are very very arrogant and stubborn. That is why they won't release next version of Valve Hammer Editor because it is enough to use. Why do Americans not develop expand of map range from -/+8192 to -/+32768. I can not understand because they are sensitive. But Id Software , Quake Mapping hasn't problem to expand map range upto -/+131072.

If you want continue your development of Sledge Editor. but map format still incorrectly. How? Maybe developers outside from the United States of America want be hero again Americans...

But you can't because map format is "Valve220" just it is not same of Quake map because it is different structure of Goldsource and Quake are very differently. I know you say me reasons....

I want tell truth because typical Americans...

// Edit:
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 17:21:24 UTC Post #329769
That is why they won't release next version of Valve Hammer Editor because it is enough to use.
That version already exist and is called Hammer 4, it is designed for Source 2004 to Source 2013 and the "next-gen" version of Hammer is already developed and it's for Source 2 (see Dota 2 Workshop Tools).
Why do Americans not develop expand of map range from -/+8192 to -/+32768.
Valve has stopped the support of GoldSource for years. After they released the 2013 update and fixed the majority of problems, they were done with GoldSource, they moved to Source 2013, Source 2, Steam, HTC Vive, CS:GO, Dota 2 and insert the rest here.
I can not understand because they are sensitive. But Id Software , Quake Mapping hasn't problem to expand map range upto -/+131072.
Do you want to know why we can extend the map limits on id Tech engines ? It's because id Software always released the FULL source code of their engines/games and the only people to get their hand on the FULL GoldSource/Half-Life engine are people who either paid for it or earned it (Sven-Coop). It's a shame that id Software stopped that tradition since id Tech 4 (RAGE/Wolfenstein The New Order/Wolfenstein The Old Blood/The Evil Within).
But you can't because map format is "Valve220" just it is not same of Quake map because it is different structure of Goldsource and Quake are very differently. I know you say me reasons....
The format isn't a barrier, how Linux is able to read/write on NTFS (Windows) partitions which Microsoft never released the specs for it ? Reverse engineering and testing. How can Jackhammer export to RMF ? Reverse engineering and testing. This how mods for "un-moddable games" are born.
Shepard62700FRHalf-Cat is watching...
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 17:44:03 UTC Post #329770
@Penguinboy
Yep! Renaming my wad files from ".WAD" to ".wad" fixed the issue! My wad-creating program exports them with a capitalized extension, so I'll have to remember to rename them for now.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 19:14:08 UTC Post #329773
@Shepard62700FR

But "Valve Hammer Editor" doesn't release more yet for Goldsource Engine because only. I know World Hammer Editor is for Source Engine 1
And other dark Hammer 5 for Source Engine 2 ( Dota )
Valve has stopped the support of GoldSource for years. After they released the 2013 update and fixed the majority of problems, they were done with GoldSource, they moved to Source 2013, Source 2, Steam, HTC Vive, CS:GO, Dota 2 and insert the rest here.
Oh no Urby is right because I can not sell Goldsource Mod, Shit that is why I must convert from old Goldsource into Source. I feel because Source Engine can to sell and to make happy and to get success. I am shy that. Grr I must "remake" Thanks for help and support. I will move to Source Engine now. But I can't understand why Valve Software lies us since Half-Life has big update since Trinity Renderer doesn't work - if you play map than you are going to "changelevel" than Half-Life stopped changelevel. But Sven Coop has "old version" of Half-Life Engine and it works fine with Trinity Renderer check my video. But gun from weapon will be crashed but it is maybe okay maybe not work?

@McSqueaky
Yeah I hope you fix it...
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 20:01:36 UTC Post #329776
@SSB Floating points are not too much of a big deal for me as I tend to rarely have such issue. If it were to happen, a simple brush recreation fixes the issue. Floating points happens mostly on terrain creating since it implies alot of vertex point movement which often lead to some points being off. However, again, this rarely happen.
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 20:13:06 UTC Post #329777
Oh no Urby is right because I can not sell Goldsource Mod, Shit that is why I must convert from old Goldsource into Source.
If you want to stick to GoldSource. You can send an e-mail to Valve to see if they still allow you to purchase a full GoldSource licence. If you want to sell a Source engine game, you will need to buy the Havok license which is \$25k and if you are using Bink/Miles Sound System buy those licenses too.
But Sven Coop has "old version" of Half-Life Engine
I thought they were using the latest version. I don't remember SC 5.0 having Direct3D support or scrapped off the SDL2 binaries. Are you sure it's really the case ?
Shepard62700FRHalf-Cat is watching...
Posted 2 years ago2016-04-10 22:43:25 UTC Post #329794
I don't know what the hell this conversation is even about anymore. Anywho...

Pengy, have you considered implementing skewing textures?
I'm vaguely aware that you can do it with something like "align to view" and certain camera angles — I'll have to find the tutorial or whatever it was that detailed that — but a more standardized method could be helpful to some.